DP experience > MYP ?

[scooter93]

Hi everyone. It is common knowledge that having experience teaching IB can make one more marketable in international education. However, something I’ve noticed is that far more schools seem to have only DP, in contrast with schools that have both MYP and DP. So, in terms of marketability, I’m just wondering if it’d be a bad idea (maybe bad is too strong a term) for one to stick with MYP for a long time or to do a bit of each program. In other words, would only having MYP experience be make one less likely to get into a tier 1 school than someone who only has DP experience?


Thanks in advanced.

[Philzim]

MYP and DP are rather different beasts, as I'm sure you know. As DP is 'content based' it's easier for teachers crossing curricula to pick up and deliver. A Level & AP teachers can deliver DP with very little extra training. However, MYP's concept based inquiry led structure takes a bit more getting used to for most teachers coming from content led curricula, esp those coming from the UK system of Key Stages & IGCSE. Therefore, despite there being fewer MYP schools than DP schools there are also fewer 'MYP ready' teachers competing for jobs. Further, in my experience candidates who have taught MYP have a good understanding of what IB want us to do with DP, they know how to talk the IB-talk and walk the IB-walk. On the other hand, DP teachers can (largely) get away with being more siloed-subject led practitioners. All in all - I think that the relative value of that MYP experience is greater than the relative value of DP experience. Of course, that's not to say that you shouldn't try to get DP experience etc etc, it's just that if you're applying for a G6-12 job in a tier 1 IB through school it is more likely that the MYP experience will get you over the line than any DP experience.

[PsyGuy]

The main SLL level curriculum used in IE are all highly congruent. DIP is structured heavily as a content framework. MYP has come along way since its early days, and has become more prescribed as requiring 50 hrs/yr which isnt much. You can get through the MYP requirements for a course in a few months. It thus depends what your IS is doing for MYP, are they stretching the MYP material out over the AY or are they using MYP or another curriculum to supplement one another. There are more IB ISs where MYP is the minor curriculum element and the IT is doing something else (it often depends on what textbook, if any the IS is using). So whether MYP is content or concept focused really depends on the IS and even the subject.
There are more DIP programs in tier 1 ISs than there are MYP programs, but there are about the same number of ITs in MYP as there are in DIP (because MYP is larger, with more age/grade levels, necessitating more ITs), and in many instances IB ITs teach both DIP and MYP.
These factors often mean that DIP ITs have better utility in recruiting than those who only have MYP experience. The major mitigating co-factor is performance. A DIP IT who averages 4s-5s has lower utility than an IT who averages 6s-7s. Which is another asst difference between DIP and MYP, in that DIP external asst is required and in MYP (eAsst) is optional (aside from the project) so how successful an IT is in MYP is often less clear than determining how a DIP IT is. An IT with strong DIP experience and high performance marks is much more marketable than an IT with MYP experience. Of course there is the scenario where a leader is trying to strengthen their MYP program and may prefer an IT with stronger MYP experience than DIP experience.

[scooter93]

Two somewhat conflicting answer but I appreciate them both. Sounds like it’s probably in my best interest to try DP at some point in time if going to a “tier 1” school really becomes that big of a deal to me. Thanks folks

[PsyGuy]

@scooter93

IB typically bridges an ITs career between the 3rd and the 1st tier as a high proportion of 2nd tier ISs are IB ISs in whole or in part. The 2nd tier is generally considered a better working environment to settle in while waiting for 1st tier and an easier position to recruit from than the 3rd tier.

[Coimbra]

scooter93 wrote:
> Hi everyone. It is common knowledge that having experience teaching IB can
> make one more marketable in international education. However, something
> I’ve noticed is that far more schools seem to have only DP, in contrast
> with schools that have both MYP and DP. So, in terms of marketability, I’m
> just wondering if it’d be a bad idea (maybe bad is too strong a term) for
> one to stick with MYP for a long time or to do a bit of each program. In
> other words, would only having MYP experience be make one less likely to
> get into a tier 1 school than someone who only has DP experience?
>
>
> Thanks in advanced.

DP is more instrumental to getting into a tier 1 school simply because 8 out of 10 of the tier 1 schools have DP while less than half of the tier 1 schools have MYP. Also true for the other tiers.
But if you are eying a particular school that has MYP + DP and your MYP experience is very solid backed up by references, then that MYP experience will do more for you than similarly good DP experience because MYP is harder to do right than DP. I have seen many confidential references of MYP teachers that were underwhelming. Best is having both of course. Just my experience though.

[PsyGuy]

Its closer to about half than 80% of tier 1 ISs that have a DIP program. Its a higher proportion of 2nd tier ISs, but the second tier is I wrote previously has a higher concentration of IB ISs. @Coimbra is probably thinking the first tier is bigger than it is with misidentifying 2nd tier ISs as 2st tier ISs.
DIP experience is still more marketable than MYP experience regardless of the IS. MYP isnt harder to do well, simply because doing MYP well is harder to determine and define. With the exception of a few founding IBWSs doing MYP well isnt a high priority, as MYP in of itself is underwhelming compared to DIP.

[Heliotrope]

PsyGuy wrote:
> Its closer to about half than 80% of tier 1 ISs that have a DIP program.
> Its a higher proportion of 2nd tier ISs, but the second tier is I wrote
> previously has a higher concentration of IB ISs. @Coimbra is probably
> thinking the first tier is bigger than it is with misidentifying 2nd tier
> ISs as 2st tier ISs.
> DIP experience is still more marketable than MYP experience regardless of
> the IS. MYP isnt harder to do well, simply because doing MYP well is harder
> to determine and define. With the exception of a few founding IBWSs doing
> MYP well isnt a high priority, as MYP in of itself is underwhelming
> compared to DIP.

It's actually 91% of tier 1 schools that offer DP, going by what most people (and not just one individual) list as tier 1 schools.

We've discussed many times what makes a tier 1 a tier 1, but most teachers will say that a tier 1 is designated as such if most teachers agree it is. There are certainly no OFFICIAL criteria for tier 1s, there's merely a sizeable overlap of preferences (a good savings potential being at the top of most teachers' list of criteria) and tier 1 designations, which is what the tier 1-list I made is based on.

But I'm happy to call it 80%, which is pretty close to what I personally believe (just like PsyGuy, my personal tier 1 list is shorter than the one I've made based on what most teachers say are tier 1 schools).

MYP is offered by less than half of the tier 1 schools: 41%.

[PsyGuy]

@Heliotrope

No, its actually around 50% of tier 1 ISs that have DIP.
There are absolutely formal criteria of tier level descriptors, including tier 1.
Yes, this has been discussed, and as noted then and again now, your list on the member side is over inflated and does not represent the master list of tier 1 ISs. Like @Coimbra you have misidentified what are really tier 2 IB ISs as being tier 1.

DIP experience is still more marketable than MYP experience regardless of the IS. MYP isnt harder to do well, simply because doing MYP well is harder to determine and define. With the exception of a few founding IBWSs doing MYP well isnt a high priority, as MYP in of itself is underwhelming compared to DIP.

[Coimbra]

Heliotrope wrote:
> It's actually 91% of tier 1 schools that offer DP, going by what most people (and not
> just one individual) list as tier 1 schools.
>
> We've discussed many times what makes a tier 1 a tier 1, but most teachers will say
> that a tier 1 is designated as such if most teachers agree it is. There are certainly
> no OFFICIAL criteria for tier 1s, there's merely a sizeable overlap of preferences (a
> good savings potential being at the top of most teachers' list of criteria) and tier
> 1 designations, which is what the tier 1-list I made is based on.
>
> But I'm happy to call it 80%, which is pretty close to what I personally believe
> (just like PsyGuy, my personal tier 1 list is shorter than the one I've made based on
> what most teachers say are tier 1 schools).
>
> MYP is offered by less than half of the tier 1 schools: 41%.





Your 91% sounds closer than my 8 out of 10 to be honest
Now that a certain American school in Japan is no longer on the current list of my top 10 dream schools, all of them have DP and 4 also have MYP, so that matches up neatly with your 41%.

[Heliotrope]

> Now that a certain American school in Japan is no longer on the current list of my
> top 10 dream schools

Just out of curiosity: why did you drop that American school in Japan from your list?

[Coimbra]

@Heliotrope
It is no longer on the list because of the taxations of benefits and the weakened yen. I love Tokyo and the school seems truly excellent but unfortunately I have financial obligations that I need to meet and that wouldn't be possible there.

[Heliotrope]

Coimbra wrote:
> @Heliotrope
> It is no longer on the list because of the taxations of benefits and the
> weakened yen. I love Tokyo and the school seems truly excellent but
> unfortunately I have financial obligations that I need to meet and that
> wouldn't be possible there.

I understand, that weakened yen is a bummer for many teachers currently in Japan, especially whose with US mortgages or university tuition bills for their kids.
I doubt the school will get a lot fewer applications though.

[zenteach]

While much is dependent upon the particular context and school, I have only MYP experience and have worked in three tier 1 schools. Just one situation out of thousands of teachers out there...

Teachers who I have seen thrive in the MYP have a certain creative spark, and tend to appreciate and value the entire IB continuum - PYP, MYP and DP.

[PsyGuy]

That AS in JP isnt going to suffer any want or loss of applications or candidates.

I find MYP ITs more creative and willing to explore novel approaches, but a more ridged and direct approach isnt just particular to DIP ITs but across SLL programs regardless of curriculum, whether it is AP, A*, DIP, etc.