Bangkok fairs this week…how is it going?

[HoraceMann]

Anyone have any impressions from the ISS fair earlier in the week, or the ongoing Search fair. I would love to hear a report.

Good luck to all who are looking.

HM

[PsyGuy]

My preliminary information (I did not go this year, for the first time in years) is that much like last year a number of schools came with interview plans in mind, and that schools tend to be waiting longer this year before offering contracts.

[twoteachers]

As a newbie going to Cambridge, that makes me feel a bit better that jobs will still be available. I'm starting to get emails that show interest, but nothing concrete. I hope my expectations aren't too high.

[reisgio]

I don't know PsyGuy, so this is not personal, but he talks a good game but you must wonder how he "knows" so much. Direct discussion with a Bangkok recruiter today yielded news that his school did major hiring, as are many, at the Search Bangkok Fair. Fact is, good couples and singles are filling up positions that are still listed on Search right now but that are in fact no longer available. Those heading to London and Cambridge better hold on, positions are going to be deleted from Bangkok Fair schools in the next 72 hours.

[honeymustard]

Deleted

[sciteach]

Although it's true that many positions will be filled at Bangkok (I think 50% of people accept a position from memory) we need to remember that quite a few of these people will then resign from their current position.

Also - many schools are still confirming who is leaving and who is staying for the next school year. As such - it's fair to say that there are still plenty of jobs out there include MANY that have not been posted as of yet.

I was just at the Melbourne Fair and there was a lot of people being offered jobs there. It seems as though there were not too many people who left feeling very unhappy from here. Some of the major schools (such as UNIS) were taking all positions to Bangkok which is fair enough. I don't like to say it - but these schools have a lot of people to choose from so they can test the markets and see who they like.

How it is all going this year - I can't really comment as I only went to BKK last year. From memory however - there is not really enough time to frequent this board during the fair as normally you are quite busy....

[PsyGuy]

@twoteachers

My apologies it was not my intent to indicate that those positions would be available by the BOS fair, they wont be, only that instead of offers at the fair, contracts will be be made after the fair.

@reisgio

This is from a couple of secondary sources. However, in the not to distant past you HAD to get an offer at BKK because the top schools were down by the time it was over. The last couple years more schools have waited until after the fair is over before making contracts.

Search has always had that problem, admins are just too busy to update their vacancies in anything close to real time, and SA doesnt invoice until after BOS. Ive seen positions filled at BKK that were still listed as current vacancies after LON.

@honeymustard

Interviews mean nothing, only offers matter. Dont kid yourself into thinking that anything else matters. recruiters are very good at making candidates "feel special", but the only special that matters is a contract.

@sciteach

Its about 35% at the BKK fair with another 40% post fair (with about another 5% pre-fair), for a total of about 8%, which holds true (in general) for the super fairs, though the weightings (fair/post fair shift).

[shadylane]

So PsyGuy

How do the Bangkok and London Search fairs compare? Is it all about geographical location / experience / type of school or something else?

Also, there seemed to be slightly more posts out there this year. Do you think that's true?

[PsyGuy]

Well kinda, the BKK fair is the rockstar for for the elite (both schools and teachers). Its in a very accessible country and attracts teachers and schools from all over. This is the top super fair (super because ISS and SA run into each other) that the top tier schools go to, and the "admin" fair which is the day before the SA fair is really the advance recruiting before signup for staff that is a schools top and first choice. Getting an invite to BKK says something very strong and positive about a candidate. There are limited IT invites and no associate wants to waste an invite on someone who isnt going to get placed. In addition a number of those top elite tier schools dont need SA or ISS at all, they could just post vacancies on their own webpage and they would still get 100s of applications. They belong as part of tradition and an exchange of status between the agency and the school. So the ITs that get invites to BKK are highly competitive because they are rockstars or they have some special niche.

LON is another super fair but merges the SA and CIS. LON is basically the IB and the "Euro" fair. Whys it the IB fair well after the USA (and Canada), then Australia the UK has the largest number of IB schools globally, combine that with the proximity and closeness of neighboring European countries (and the isolation of Australia), it makes a good place for the Euro powers to congregate. Its easily accessible, and has a very common language. The other factor is the "euro" fair component. There are a number of schools (a significant number) that cant, wont, or would prefer NOT to hire faculty who dont have an EU passport, and where better to find a the most convenient concentration of EU citizens but in the EU.
The third factor, when looking at European national curriculums (Lycee, Gymnasium, IGCSE, A levels, etc) and their related ISs, there is more commonality among European regions, and again higher concentrations of available staff.

Lastly, Europeans tend to think they are more refined, sophisticated and cultured, so they feel more comfortable together.

The number of posts is illusional, more schools are increasing their use of virtual/online interviewing and screening, and as a result are going to fewer fairs throughout the season, increasing the number of vacancies they are recruiting for. Even so the difference isnt statistically significant.

[twoteachers]

As a newbie in the international scene, is the Cambridge fair even a worthwhile venture? I do have some recruiters wishing to meet with me there. Is that a true good sign? I still haven't bought my plane ticket yet.....

[wrldtrvlr123]

twoteachers wrote:
> As a newbie in the international scene, is the Cambridge fair even a
> worthwhile venture? I do have some recruiters wishing to meet with me
> there. Is that a true good sign? I still haven't bought my plane ticket
> yet.....
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It's a good sign. You (generally) can't get a job offer without an interview and if schools are asking or are open to talking to you at the fair then there is at least some interest in you as a viable candidate. Are these schools/locations you would be happy to accept? Attention from schools is much better than no contact or responses back from schools before the fair.

Cambridge is generally a fair where hiring is done and depending on your certification areas and experience you could conceivably find a job there. That being said, there are no guarantees and a fair is always a gamble. You may get to the fair and find those schools have filled their positions or get there and find open positions at great schools that you weren't expecting.

So, positive signs but only you can decide if you can afford to take the gamble.

[tangchao]

I really think it's time we stopped fooling ourselves here. Bangkok is just the scramble to pick up singles and teaching couples. Only one percent of those hired last year had dependents. This comes straight from an associate.

I was a rockstar too when I went there as a single bloke. When I went with a dependent spouse but far more experience in the international scene I was an absolute pariah. Didn't even get an invite this time. :'(

[calciodirigore]

Completely agree with tangchao.

Went as a single to Search fair with 8 years of IB experience at tops schools and got 11 interviews and 10 job offers.

Went as a teacher with a dependent a few years later and got 2 interviews and no job offers.

Several of my colleagues have experienced this as well.

[vandsmith]

not to sound too cold, but i think it's par for the course, especially if you're talking pure economics. a teacher with a trailing spouse with little or no option of working at the school - or a single with a child - is risky. and i think that's true in terms of your health and your quality of life, e.g. one salary, nannies, housing, etc...

sure, good schools will look past it and actually look at your credentials, but (and i know somewhere PsyGuy is nodding) for the most part, they can get just as good teachers with less "negative" points attached.

it sucks hard but it seems to be just the way it is. i never really understood why teachers with trailing spouses go to BKK in the first place, or LDN for that matter. wait for the other NA fairs if it's cheaper for you, or try to arrange skype interviews with schools outside of the fairs. going to BKK seems like a great way to become disillusioned!

i wish you the best of luck!!!

v.

[tangchao]

I don't think anyone but singles and married teaching couples gets invited to BKK anymore.