I was just offered the position as college counselor at my school. I’ve been doing it informally for the past year, but have now been offered several additional prep periods to establish a college-counseling program. Personally, I’m incredibly excited to move into this role. Working with kids to get them into the right school is a true passion of mine. Professionally, I’m not sure how to proceed with the position.
I will complete my M.Ed. in Educational Leadership and be licensed as an administrator. However, I do not have any sort of counseling certification. My role at the school will be strictly college counseling, career planning and test admin and a full time counselor will complete the rest of the counseling duties (i.e. scheduling, group work, etc…). In the future, I could very well see myself moving more towards the college counseling side of things if possible. I do have a couple of questions about my potential future as a college counselor.
1) Should I pursue certification as a college counselor? I know there are several certification programs in the states that are like 12-15 credits of grad courses. That would at least get me some sort of certification as a college counselor. I’d hate to have the experience but nothing official if I tried to apply as a college counselor somewhere else. I have no intention of enrolling in a full counseling program as I’m unwilling to go back to school for 2-3 years and complete the onerous internship and supervised practice requirements. Plus, I’m really not that interested in counseling outside of college admissions.
2) Do some international schools hire counselors that deal with college counseling exclusively? As stated early, I don’t want to pursue the full counseling degree and am not interested in other aspects of counseling.
3) Lastly, will experience with college counseling make me more marketable as an administrator? If I have a few years of college counseling experience, with a college counseling certification and a M.Ed. in Educational Leadership with a license in the US, will I be an attractive candidate? Plus, 8 years of teaching experience.
Thanks for any feedback. Also, if there is anyone out there with tips on setting up a solid college counseling program, I’d love to hear it (i.e. books, websites, etc…).
College Counseling?
Not worth it
A 15 hour graduate certificate program, unless it actually gets you a state educator certification as a school counselor, isnt really going to be worth the paper its printed on.
College counseling and advising is becoming (has become) VERY popular and important. It used to be students did their Bachelors work locally, and then went abroad for their graduate work. Thats changed and more students are leaving for the USA and UK for their undergraduate work. At the very large schools the college counselor position can be exclusively full time. As schools get smaller, school counselors have to do more. Try to understand that the "mental health" component of a school counselor at an IS, is a very small part of the job.
Any admin experience is going to help you move up the admin chain. That said college counseling as a counselor is not the "management" focused type of admin position you want in a principal or head. You would honestly be better off moving from a coordinator, or assistant principal position to move up the admin ladder. Counselors tend to stay where they are, sometimes you see one become the assistant/vice principal of students (dean of students) but they seldom become principals. Usually curriculum ap/vp, is the fast track to principal/head.
Lastly, it really sounds like once you have your M.Ed. and admin certificate you will be ready, why sit in the counseling office?
College counseling and advising is becoming (has become) VERY popular and important. It used to be students did their Bachelors work locally, and then went abroad for their graduate work. Thats changed and more students are leaving for the USA and UK for their undergraduate work. At the very large schools the college counselor position can be exclusively full time. As schools get smaller, school counselors have to do more. Try to understand that the "mental health" component of a school counselor at an IS, is a very small part of the job.
Any admin experience is going to help you move up the admin chain. That said college counseling as a counselor is not the "management" focused type of admin position you want in a principal or head. You would honestly be better off moving from a coordinator, or assistant principal position to move up the admin ladder. Counselors tend to stay where they are, sometimes you see one become the assistant/vice principal of students (dean of students) but they seldom become principals. Usually curriculum ap/vp, is the fast track to principal/head.
Lastly, it really sounds like once you have your M.Ed. and admin certificate you will be ready, why sit in the counseling office?
Perspective
Well sure its better then nothing, if it was free, and didnt take up a lot of your time Id say sure if you had nothing better to do. Other then that its not going to mean anything
Your really going to need a school counselor certificate if you want to be mobile and compete outside of your school. If you already have a Masters or will soon have one, you can probably find a program somewhere in the USA that wont be quit 2 years, more like a year. You might also want to try looking globally, in some countries being a school counselor means just having a Masters degree in a related field.
Your really going to need a school counselor certificate if you want to be mobile and compete outside of your school. If you already have a Masters or will soon have one, you can probably find a program somewhere in the USA that wont be quit 2 years, more like a year. You might also want to try looking globally, in some countries being a school counselor means just having a Masters degree in a related field.
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eion_padraig
- Posts: 408
- Joined: Sat Dec 11, 2010 8:18 pm
OACAC would be the most useful of the ACAC conferences to attend if you have good numbers of students applying to US and Canadian universities. UK universities representatives attend the OACAC conference in good numbers as well. It's during the summer, so it's much easier to get to than the NACAC conference in the fall and the NACAC conference is way too big. I go to both conferences each year, but OACAC is way better. This year, both conferences happen to be in Denver. OACAC is in mid-July every year, NACAC is in late September/early October.
There is also a CIS conference in the fall which college admission representatives attend and school/college counselors as an alternative to OACAC and NACAC.
I've met relatively few college counselors at international schools who don't have a MA in school counseling, but there seems to be a trend towards some international schools hiring separate people for emotional/social counseling and college counseling. A lot of the top schools still want people to do both. Often the college counselors have experience working in US independent schools and/or college admission. I'd think you be limited by the number of schools you could get hired at without a MA in counseling. That's one reason I took the time and effort to get a school counseling degree.
There is also a CIS conference in the fall which college admission representatives attend and school/college counselors as an alternative to OACAC and NACAC.
I've met relatively few college counselors at international schools who don't have a MA in school counseling, but there seems to be a trend towards some international schools hiring separate people for emotional/social counseling and college counseling. A lot of the top schools still want people to do both. Often the college counselors have experience working in US independent schools and/or college admission. I'd think you be limited by the number of schools you could get hired at without a MA in counseling. That's one reason I took the time and effort to get a school counseling degree.
Nice
Joining some those organizations/associations would be easy and may give you some added credibility, but its not going to be a deal maker. The real gold standard and i know you dont want to hear it again, is getting your school counselor certification. Its the most marketable credential you can get, and its going to put you on an even playing field, when and if you move to another school. You dont want to miss out on an offer because a school went with another candidate "because they were certified". This was an unusual year for school counselors, normally there isnt this level of demand.
That said I want to ask, is being a college counselor what you really want to do with your career? I ask because there is seldom any advancement opportunities. Counselors generally stay counselors. If your looking for more flexibility and options stick with being an admin, you can do everything from curriculum coordinator, to principal/head, and there are a lot of director and coordinator positions in between.
That said I want to ask, is being a college counselor what you really want to do with your career? I ask because there is seldom any advancement opportunities. Counselors generally stay counselors. If your looking for more flexibility and options stick with being an admin, you can do everything from curriculum coordinator, to principal/head, and there are a lot of director and coordinator positions in between.
There are many people who do college counseling without a counseling degree - they typically were former teachers or former university admission reps. Nearly all have felt adrift without having some experience with personal counseling since the college counseling process can be extremely emotional and can bring up family conflict.
I find it a bit sad that some posts on this board are about how to get a job with the least amount of education/experience. I rarely hear (if ever) the consideration for the very students they will be working with. The education and experience will make you better equipped to deal with the students' needs - many times you are all they have! No you don't need a degree, but wouldn't you want to be best prepared to work with the students and be able to serve them professionally and ethically? I have worked with a couple under-educated and inexperienced counselors and their actions have been detrimental to students. Yes, they got to live in a nice place and travel the world, but students suffered. Often those people were encouraged to move on but their negative impact remained.
However, to answer your question, there are a couple things you can do. Go to OACAC this summer in Denver. There is also something run at Georgetown University by the CollegeBoard on international university admissions - also very worth it - it's at the end of June.
I find it a bit sad that some posts on this board are about how to get a job with the least amount of education/experience. I rarely hear (if ever) the consideration for the very students they will be working with. The education and experience will make you better equipped to deal with the students' needs - many times you are all they have! No you don't need a degree, but wouldn't you want to be best prepared to work with the students and be able to serve them professionally and ethically? I have worked with a couple under-educated and inexperienced counselors and their actions have been detrimental to students. Yes, they got to live in a nice place and travel the world, but students suffered. Often those people were encouraged to move on but their negative impact remained.
However, to answer your question, there are a couple things you can do. Go to OACAC this summer in Denver. There is also something run at Georgetown University by the CollegeBoard on international university admissions - also very worth it - it's at the end of June.
Clarification
Many college counselors dont have a degree in counseling that is very true, but I was referring to a school counselor "certification" issued by a government or ministry agency responsible for issuing educator credentials.
In this case the OP is finishing up an M.Ed and administrator certificate, short of actual college counseling experience (which he already has a year of doing unofficially) there is little else that is going to add to the OP's value utility in college counseling.
Aside from that my issue is that what we do as educators is some kind of magic or highly specialized/technical. This isnt medicine, or rocket science. Being a teacher is certainly work, and hard work, but the intellectual component of that isnt very advance. The key to being a great teacher is creativity, patience, persistence, and having a personality coated in non-stick teflon. To that end (having been a college counselor), the knowledge base of applying to schools, completing applications, resumes, essays, navigating immigration, and financial aid, doesnt rise to the level of needing a doctorate in some lost language. Its just not all that difficult, and at an international school what makes the difference really is having someone from that country who knows their way around the process. You can pick up a couple of books off Amazon and read up on enough of the process to be a college counselor.
In this case the OP is finishing up an M.Ed and administrator certificate, short of actual college counseling experience (which he already has a year of doing unofficially) there is little else that is going to add to the OP's value utility in college counseling.
Aside from that my issue is that what we do as educators is some kind of magic or highly specialized/technical. This isnt medicine, or rocket science. Being a teacher is certainly work, and hard work, but the intellectual component of that isnt very advance. The key to being a great teacher is creativity, patience, persistence, and having a personality coated in non-stick teflon. To that end (having been a college counselor), the knowledge base of applying to schools, completing applications, resumes, essays, navigating immigration, and financial aid, doesnt rise to the level of needing a doctorate in some lost language. Its just not all that difficult, and at an international school what makes the difference really is having someone from that country who knows their way around the process. You can pick up a couple of books off Amazon and read up on enough of the process to be a college counselor.
I don't think we are disagreeing. However, there are college counselors and then there are trained guidance counselors who, developmentally, provide guidance for post-secondary options. Those who have gone through a school counselor university program are most likely better equipped to deal with all the emotions and personal/family turmoil that seems to go along with the university process. I wholeheartedly agree that you can learn the process of "college counseling" from books and experience. I also know many "college counselors" that feel ill-equipped to deal with the issues that then sway away from the books. Our school has learned from experience and we would never hire someone now who does have a guidance counseling background - even to do college counseling.
I don't want to get into a whole discussion about this. Organizations are providing training on the "soft skills" now and where there is a will there is a way. Picking up some books on Amazon is a good start, but it just a start.
I don't want to get into a whole discussion about this. Organizations are providing training on the "soft skills" now and where there is a will there is a way. Picking up some books on Amazon is a good start, but it just a start.
:)
I dont think were disagreeing either. I would say a teacher with 8 years experience, an M.Ed and an admin certificate has the soft skills to be a college counselor.
The hardest part for me was dealing with the students, and their families when the rejection letters came in. They all want to believe they are going to an ivy, and then when that doesnt happen, the waterworks start.
The hardest part for me was dealing with the students, and their families when the rejection letters came in. They all want to believe they are going to an ivy, and then when that doesnt happen, the waterworks start.
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eion_padraig
- Posts: 408
- Joined: Sat Dec 11, 2010 8:18 pm
Without a MA in school counseling or counseling will someone be limited by their choices in international schools at this point in time? Certainly. Again, I think there are most schools going to the model that US independent schools use in which you have separate college counselors and school counselors; some may not be able to because of local laws related to getting visa or for various reasons. However,Taipei American School is one that has gone this route and I believe it was American College of Sofia in Bulgaria that also hired a former college admissions rep to work as their college counselor in the past. If you want to work in US independent schools, having a counseling degree is far less important that having admission experience or having previous experience working as a college counselor. But again, we're talking about international schools here.
Having done a MA in school counseling, I would say quite a lot of the classes and much of the training was irrelevant for college counseling issues. And most people with [b]just[/b] a school counseling degree will know little about college admission. Very few school counseling programs have any curriculum at all that helps counselors understand the ins and outs of college admission and I think it is fair to say that working with international students in the process adds a layer of complexity. It's a real weakness in US graduate school programs which ASCA and ACA have very little interest in addressing. CACREP, the organization which accredits counseling programs has done nothing to require a focus on college admission. I went to a NACAC session on this very issue at the Baltimore conference, so there are some people thinking about it, but little seems to be happening. But again, not enough public high schools in the US have school counselors who are given the time, even if they have the inclination, to attend conferences and visit colleges where they'll learn about the issues related to college admission and financial aid. Again, I would argue it is even more complex given the student body of most international schools because they're more likely to be looking at many countries where they may continue their education. Maybe other countries are addressing college admission issues better in their training, but I would argue US higher education is more diverse and harder to navigate the admission process than in Canada, the UK, and Australia (3 other countries that I am rather familiar with).
I suspect one reason that US independent schools have gone to find people with specialist knowledge related to college admission is that they could no longer find (and perhaps steal) school counselors away from the public schools who have good in depth knowledge about admission practices in universities as they did in the past.
Do some of the practical counseling skills help being a good college counselor? Certainly, but easily 1/3 to 1/2 of my classes were irrelevant for working in US independent schools and independent international schools. Could you develop good counseling skills another way? Yes, you certainly could. But would you be more limited in your choices within the international schools. For the time being, I think so.
Having done a MA in school counseling, I would say quite a lot of the classes and much of the training was irrelevant for college counseling issues. And most people with [b]just[/b] a school counseling degree will know little about college admission. Very few school counseling programs have any curriculum at all that helps counselors understand the ins and outs of college admission and I think it is fair to say that working with international students in the process adds a layer of complexity. It's a real weakness in US graduate school programs which ASCA and ACA have very little interest in addressing. CACREP, the organization which accredits counseling programs has done nothing to require a focus on college admission. I went to a NACAC session on this very issue at the Baltimore conference, so there are some people thinking about it, but little seems to be happening. But again, not enough public high schools in the US have school counselors who are given the time, even if they have the inclination, to attend conferences and visit colleges where they'll learn about the issues related to college admission and financial aid. Again, I would argue it is even more complex given the student body of most international schools because they're more likely to be looking at many countries where they may continue their education. Maybe other countries are addressing college admission issues better in their training, but I would argue US higher education is more diverse and harder to navigate the admission process than in Canada, the UK, and Australia (3 other countries that I am rather familiar with).
I suspect one reason that US independent schools have gone to find people with specialist knowledge related to college admission is that they could no longer find (and perhaps steal) school counselors away from the public schools who have good in depth knowledge about admission practices in universities as they did in the past.
Do some of the practical counseling skills help being a good college counselor? Certainly, but easily 1/3 to 1/2 of my classes were irrelevant for working in US independent schools and independent international schools. Could you develop good counseling skills another way? Yes, you certainly could. But would you be more limited in your choices within the international schools. For the time being, I think so.
Thanks for all the great feedback. Especially from those of you that are currently working as counselors.
So, I know it would be better if I had the Masters in Counseling and certification. However, I don’t see that happening as I am currently abroad and am finished up my M.Ed. in Educational Leadership. I always thought that counseling would be cool but the “mental healthâ€
So, I know it would be better if I had the Masters in Counseling and certification. However, I don’t see that happening as I am currently abroad and am finished up my M.Ed. in Educational Leadership. I always thought that counseling would be cool but the “mental healthâ€