The International Schools Review Forum

Yes, please add a small note. I personally prefer a note card or “real” paper, but the fair provides standard slips for you to use if you don’t have your own. Not really a major issue.

@sid
Thank you, will do!!

Go for the job you want, too.

@shadowjack

I will. Right now, I only have 10 schools for the moment that I am interested in, but if I break it down, I am really interested in only 5 of them. My odds aren't great, but I will give it my all. And they are spread out from Asia to Europe.... so we shall see.

Ideally, how many schools should one have to try and get an initial interview at least?

Frenchie, it depends on what you want and where you are willing to go. I had I think, 9 interviews in Bangkok. Some other people had none. Others were in between. I read once about a guy who had 15. A trifle excessive and time consuming...

I would say if you have 4 or 5 interviews you are doing well...

Take the ones with which you are comfortable. If you have more time to rest so you're sharp or attend a few extra presentations, great! If you think there is a chance you will take the job, take the interview. Just be sure you don't waste time--your own or theirs. But when in doubt, go for it. Far easier to back out after one interview than to get an interview after signups.

Thank you very much. All great advice!! Ok too if I end up with no interviews either - I know will be a bit disappointing but I am ok with that. I will try to give a little report from Beantown.

@Sid

At least one of us is learning something.

Rules are important.

@Thames Pirate

I dont tell them or disclose the why of the rejection, too often it leads to some followup or something, and I dont want to go round and round with a decision thats already done with. So much of the 'fit' is personal and things you cant really change, an ITs personality is just who they are.

Its usually very specific criteria at signup that have just been decided in advance, and theres so many candidates when ou start opening it up it suddenly becomes "everyone" and its not possible or even desirable to interview everyone. Everyone who gets through the door and into signup can teach.

A lot of the advance hiring decisions are screening related, the ITs whos only experience with a BUS/ECON background is teaching some business English just isnt hat the job requires.

References arent that valuable, they are basically positive, what I value is getting an ITs reporting supervisor and just asking the questions like 'would you hire this person again and with what if any reservation", those are the things that matter.

It depends what the position and current status quo is, if theres a big push by ownership to bring up Literature IB exam scores, I dont have the time to figure out if your AP experience or whatever is going to transition quickly and effectively to the IB program. Lit is also one of those areas where the ITs proficiency with the reading list is more important, if you have great AP scores but minimal experience with the works the IS has on curriculum thats an issue, and not one Im likely to work with if i dont have to, and since the fairs are at the beginning of general recruiting season, Im more likely to hold out and wait than I am going to feel pressured to fill that position. The deal breakers are deal breakers, but they are usually small issues, not huge factors or criteria.

References dont play much of a role, Its too early to go picking through the writing between the lines that early in the screening and selection process.

Usually have a couple advanced first night invites a few weeks before the fair. The other invites, about 3 per vacancy start the day before departure. The rest of it is seeing who is interested in the IS and visits us. Do most of the resumes sorting and screening the night before signup. Those are the ITs that actually showed up. The rest in ongoing, with a significant look before lunch, because we want to close with one of those preferred candidates on the first day, so they can accept/decline before the next day, the sooner the better. The rest of its just filler. Theres one candidate for first night, then three after that that get invites, those take the process to after lunch and lunch is then sending out some email invites. ITs have a better idea how they did and where their recruiting is going after signup. Check the box in the morning, at lunch/mid day and then in the evening after dinner.

Presentation is just a slide show that covers the standard marketing material, than its FAQ, thats what attendees really want, they have a question about the IS and they dont really have a venue or place to just ask.

@teacher tan

I agree, most leadership dont know much beyond basic meds/peds, unless they were or are still currently a classroom IT in their subject.
I also agree rules are a CORE part of classroom management, too few rules and expectations become vague and ambiguous. I also agree that when your recruiting you really do have this vision of an ideal candidate and its over time that you negotiate what you will settle for, but early in the recruiting cycle leadership/recruiters want everything.

Many elite tier ISs do not have to innovate, or even try. They really dont need to do much of anything.

@SJ

"We should be able to engage in a pedagogical discussion where our views might not be the same, but we actually have views."

Hear, hear, well said.

@secondplace

So much about fit is working well with the current personalities from students, to staff, to faculty, to parents, and leadership. If your shy Im not going to be a therapist and try and open them up, theres limited time and so many candidates and applicants Im not going to go fishing or pull teeth to get what i need out of candidate to determine if they are going to be a good fit. Moreover IE has a different behavior management dynamic, and a much bigger part of controlling a classroom in being organized, prepared, and confident, projecting that is going to greatly reduce behavior problems going forward.

I agree with @Thames Pirate though, if your not comfortable than its probably not a good fit for you either, and youre interviewing them as much as they are interviewing them, even if the power differential is so heavily skewed to the recruiter and leadership.

@falloutmike

Congrats, good job.

Its hard to organize anything that isnt general and generic, recruiting fairs arent PD.

@Frenchie

If your going to go through all the work of an Ichiro, etc than pick up some generic thank you note cards, etc, and attach (paperclip) the note with your Ichiro. if your applying with a resume and its not signup, than they have PCs and printer, bring some nice resume paper and do individual cover letters. Print out whatever color elements in advance and use them like stationary for an introduction/cover letter.

How many interviews do you want? Interviews dont matter, offers matter, so your goal should be as many interviews as you can handle with ISs that you would accept an offer from them (unless you just want to practice interviews, having a throw away interview early to shake the nerves out isnt a bad idea). I never had more than around 14 but there were candidates who were around 20. Then there are those who only want WE or only want Japan and thats it, and they get zero interviews and leave before lunch on the day of signup.
If you have 10 ISs, getting 5 interviews at those ISs is really good, getting 2 or 3 is probably more the norm. If you get zero at signup, than plan around presentations and hoping to pick something up on day to, but if lunch on day 2 has come and pass, and its approaching dinner its time get right with your head and move on.

PsyGuy wrote:
> @Thames Pirate
>
> I dont tell them or disclose the why of the rejection, too often it leads to some
> followup or something, and I dont want to go round and round with a decision thats
> already done with. So much of the 'fit' is personal and things you cant really change,
> an ITs personality is just who they are.
>
> Its usually very specific criteria at signup that have just been decided in advance,
> and theres so many candidates when ou start opening it up it suddenly becomes "everyone"
> and its not possible or even desirable to interview everyone. Everyone who gets
> through the door and into signup can teach.
>
> A lot of the advance hiring decisions are screening related, the ITs whos only experience
> with a BUS/ECON background is teaching some business English just isnt hat the job
> requires.
>
> References arent that valuable, they are basically positive, what I value is getting
> an ITs reporting supervisor and just asking the questions like 'would you hire this
> person again and with what if any reservation", those are the things that matter.
>
>
> It depends what the position and current status quo is, if theres a big push by ownership
> to bring up Literature IB exam scores, I dont have the time to figure out if your
> AP experience or whatever is going to transition quickly and effectively to the
> IB program. Lit is also one of those areas where the ITs proficiency with the reading
> list is more important, if you have great AP scores but minimal experience with
> the works the IS has on curriculum thats an issue, and not one Im likely to work
> with if i dont have to, and since the fairs are at the beginning of general recruiting
> season, Im more likely to hold out and wait than I am going to feel pressured to
> fill that position. The deal breakers are deal breakers, but they are usually small
> issues, not huge factors or criteria.
>
> References dont play much of a role, Its too early to go picking through the writing
> between the lines that early in the screening and selection process.
>
> Usually have a couple advanced first night invites a few weeks before the fair. The
> other invites, about 3 per vacancy start the day before departure. The rest of it
> is seeing who is interested in the IS and visits us. Do most of the resumes sorting
> and screening the night before signup. Those are the ITs that actually showed up.
> The rest in ongoing, with a significant look before lunch, because we want to close
> with one of those preferred candidates on the first day, so they can accept/decline
> before the next day, the sooner the better. The rest of its just filler. Theres
> one candidate for first night, then three after that that get invites, those take
> the process to after lunch and lunch is then sending out some email invites. ITs
> have a better idea how they did and where their recruiting is going after signup.
> Check the box in the morning, at lunch/mid day and then in the evening after dinner.
>
>
> Presentation is just a slide show that covers the standard marketing material, than
> its FAQ, thats what attendees really want, they have a question about the IS and
> they dont really have a venue or place to just ask.
===================
TFF. All of this from your many year of previous admin/recruiting experience?

PS: I don't think the one year of (allegedly) sneaking in to try and guerrilla recruit at one job fair carries that much weight.

The claim that most references are positive quickly reveals a lack of familiarity with the subject matter.

I know to ignore anything PsyGuy says in the role of admin/recruiter, but it's good that others say something so the casual reader knows to take his advice with a grain of salt in this area. And perhaps in a few others.

@Sid

A lack of familiarity for you. How you get negative reviews isnt some IT who knowingly provides them, its they dont know whats in their profile, and their associate/consultant didnt really confirm or verify. Otherwise yes references are either over the top positive, mutely positive, or they are neutral.

PsyGuy wrote:
>
> References arent that valuable, they are basically positive

PsyGuy wrote:
>
> References dont play much of a role


Confidential references are also references, and they can play a big role from what I've understood from the people doing the recruiting at my current and previous schools, and they are definitely not always positive. Once my references got me an interview that went very well and led to a job, where my cover letter and CV didn't.

If you've ever filled out a Search reference form, it is proforma - but when you are contacted, the questions ask for nuances that are not proforma - and thus can lead to an interview or not. Plus, they will not all be positive and a given. They will be shaded according to the questions asked (why did you give a 7 here?). Then a follow up question or two that will winnow out more of what the recruiter wants to know.

just my two halalas...

Having reviewed a lot of the confidential references provided through Search I know that they are not all positive. Far from it. Which does give me some confidence in their accuracy and usefulness.