The International Schools Review Forum

@Heliotrope

No water is wet, wetness is defined as a liquids ability to adhere to the surface of a solid, and water can exist in three states of matter, one of them being a solid we call this solid ice. As the ice melts the layer of water that forms on top of it is in its liquid form, and because of van der waals forces the cohesion of water to itself is higher than the adhesion of water to a human touching it, the water is indeed wetter to itself than it is to you.

I have problems with that differentiation for two reasons: First, because of the way IB classifies maths into integrated clusters as opposed to discreet maths fields (algebra, calculus, statistics, geometry, etc.) (and the issue that those designations studies, SL, HL, and further are going away and being replaced with - and Approaches and Applications and Interpretations, both at SL and HL). Studies still has calculus in it (though differential calculus is easier than integral calculus), and HL maths has integral calculus as an option, an IT can work the syllabus even in HL maths to minimize maths topics they are 'uncomfortable' with. Id be more comfortable with further maths and math studies, but that brings me to my second reason.
Second, its very unlikely an IT could realistically compartmentalize themselves into just teaching studies and SL maths without teaching HL maths and further maths. DIP is only two years how do you fill out a FTE schedule doing just half of DIP, which is still upper secondary and SLL. I just dont see how you sell that to a recruiter/leadership, they still have to hire someone else to teach the half of maths DIP you cant.
Id be more comfortable differentiating from lower secondary/primary maths and upper secondary/SLL maths, in which case I would put lower secondary maths below physics.

Kind of a reach there with the wet ice example, but I'll let it go.

I make the differentiation because I know a lot of Maths teachers that can't teach HL Maths, but have been teaching SL and SL Studies for years. HL Maths teachers however have no problem teaching SL or Studies (although some prefer not to do so if they can avoid it).
And since I do read 'everywhere' that HL Maths teachers have it easiest finding a job, and the differentiation is apparently being used, I was just wondering how the SL teachers (that can't teach HL) rank.

@Heliotrope

Not a reach.

I didnt want to create an "IB" subjects list, but a generic subjects list. You can of course make those distinctions if you want. My issue is how do you distinguish maths ITs, based solely on what they have a preference to teach or what they just happen to be assigned. Its just not something I want to do.

Whatever you need to tell yourself...

There's actually a large group of Maths teachers at IB schools that can only teach SL & Studies (or prefer to), as well as schools that will hire them to teach those and not HL, so with the SL & Studies Maths teachers being a bit less easily employable than the HL Maths teachers, it might warrant to put them lower on the list, although still pretty high up, may be down 2 or 3 spots although that's just a guess.
To paint a more complete picture, I know quite a few HL Maths teachers that are definitely less able to teach a good Maths Studies class than a dedicated SL & Studies teacher, despite knowing the subject matter very well.

At smaller schools SL and MS also usually do MYP 4 and 5 or a mix thereof.

Civics/government is an odd bird because each country has its own government and its own local requirements. So if you taught AP government in the US, it's less useful when trying to teach a ministry-required civics and government class in some other country. In international schools you don't find IB US Government, but instead might find IB ITGS or Global Politics (new course). As these are far newer than, say, history, experience in them is far more valuable than the list might indicate. Furthermore, humanities teachers are often lumped together (geo, history, civics, etc.) at all but the DP level, so you often get postings that say "humanities teacher, ideally with DP Geo experience." Thus I would not split out most of the humanities unless it's econ. Not every humanities teacher can teach theory of the firm effectively, but most can do history or geo if they are halfway competent. Beyond that it's just curriculum experience.

@Thames Pirate

I put 'Global Perspectives' individually and higher on the scale than Political Science/Civics/Government, which is whatever the curriculum wants to call their "Global Studies" course/program whether its Global Perspectives, Information Technology in a Global Society, Global Politics, Global Citizenship, etc.

Originally I had PoliSci independent of civics/government for exactly the reason you cited. Regional civics/government is often taught by a local trained in that course and some type of global course is preferred over a national US/UK/AUS/CAN type of civics/government course in IE. However, when I ranked them because PoliSci is so rare, and often is an elective grouped in with other social studies departments they were both at the same level, with PoliSci right above Civics/Government. Based on your position I have returned the list to separated PoliSci and Civics/Governments subjects as described above.

A couple of points....

From my school's experience, recruiting quality Geography teachers has been more difficult in recent years than Biology or Languages - in particular, with IGCSE / DP experience. For politics, although there is an A Level politics course in England it is not widely studied below that so the number of teachers who teach this is limited (appreciate it might be different for AP in the US though.)

For me, if you're not using the IB system then the only core subjects should be English and Maths (and even then, there is a question of whether there should be any core subjects at all - if someone is doing Physics at HL, if you're trying to promote a balanced education why do they need Maths at HL too, or even Maths Studies? Why English in an IS, ahead of their native tongue?)

I feel there's far too little talk about equestrianism and aboriginal languages this time around.

That was my favorite part of the other thread!

expatscot wrote:
> A couple of points....
>
> From my school's experience, recruiting quality Geography teachers has been
> more difficult in recent years than Biology or Languages - in particular,
> with IGCSE / DP experience. For politics, although there is an A Level
> politics course in England it is not widely studied below that so the
> number of teachers who teach this is limited (appreciate it might be
> different for AP in the US though.)
>
> For me, if you're not using the IB system then the only core subjects
> should be English and Maths (and even then, there is a question of whether
> there should be any core subjects at all - if someone is doing Physics at
> HL, if you're trying to promote a balanced education why do they need Maths
> at HL too, or even Maths Studies? Why English in an IS, ahead of their
> native tongue?)

With IGCSE/IB aren't you mostly restricting yourself to UK teachers? Sure, some others might have taught IGCSE but not that many. If you are looking for IGCSE experience then you are already narrowing your focus.

As for why English in an IS? It's one of the main reasons for them. Parents want their kids to learn in English and be proficient in them. ISs hire teachers that think that way too. So, a bit of a self-perpetuating cycle. There's a bit of neocolonialism at the heart of the international school system that it's hard to deny. Ultimately, the idea is that western education at the IS = better than the local system is rife in many countries. Wanting your kid speaking first language level English is part of that, wouldn't you say?

Thames Pirate wrote:
> The equestrian specialist thread was deleted for good reason.

Why was it deleted?

PsyGuy went into more and more imagined detail on the unicorn position, those of us with horse knowledge pointed out that his explanations made less and less sense, and I admit to getting sucked into a tit-for-tat with him because he pretended to know something about horses. He took it as a personal affront that some of us actually know something about the field.

Anyway, I still think the humanities are relatively interchangeable except for econ and that absent DP experience teachers are equally competitive. Finding DP Geo experience might be tricky, but finding someone capable of teaching it who might not have taught it before is not.

@expatscot

I balanced my list for global demand and supply, not specific to UK or any other NC IS. Just looking at IB stats, geography had about 9000 candidates to put that in perspective thats less than 20% of those in history (the most) and less than half of the common subjects such as economics, business, psychology, its about twice of the number of Philosophy candidates. Whereas biology had over 51000 candidates and was the most popular science course taken

PoliSci isnt that big in AP either.

I dont know why youd say outside of IB core subjects maths and English are the only importance or value. Unis want to see a conventional program and regional accrediting organizations have similar curriculum expectations. Ofsted inspections arent going to be successful if your not providing the UK NC and thats more than just maths and literature.

Why do they need maths because Unis for technical steam programs want to see a coherent sequence of courses.

Its not English language its English literature, being a fluent native speaker doesnt mean you have any understanding of the classics cannon of literature.

@Illiane_Blues

It was deleted because @Thames Pirate couldnt accept that a equestrian vacancy that she wasnt considered for could exist, and over the long course of the discussion it became apparent her expertise was extremely limited to those of us who had expertise in riding and equestrian sports. If she didnt know about it or her imagined and convenient one friend who claimed to be an Olympian didnt hear about than it didnt exist and she just wouldnt let it drop that she didnt know hat she was talking about either about horses or the position.

I never applied and would not have as I am not an instructor and, more significantly, the position did not exist. I was, however, a professional in the industry, and it wasn't "one friend who claimed to be an Olympian." I also did not need to resort to citing some website over and over. But if you were in the sport you'd know we are one community, Olympians included, across levels and with regular contact. In other words, nobody seriously involved has "one friend who claimed to be an Olympian." We all clinic with them, compete against them, stable with them, walk courses with them, etc.

But whatever. Let's not restart the nonsense that this unicorn position ever existed. This is a teacher board.

@Thames Pirate

Most importantly, the vacancy absolutely existed, just not for you. You wouldnt have applied because you werent qualified for the position based on the specs, and if you had your application would have been binned. Summer camp riding in a denim skirt and cow girl boots does not make you a professional rider. Oh right were one community they give the gold medal to everyone in the community.

The only nonsense is you having any position or claim in the vacancy at all. Yes an educator board for educator vacancies like an equestrian coach for a K12/KS IS.