I'm repeatedly reading that it is important to talk to current teachers at a school before accepting a contract. And that makes perfect sense to me. However I need advice about how to accomplish that when at a job fair. I will be at the SA Cambridge fair. If I am offered a contract (or hopefully several to choose between) at the fair and am only given a day or so to give them my answer, how do I contact current employees to get the scoop? It seems like the time frame is too short for the logistics that requires.
If the only contact I've received back from a school is the automated form email saying "they'll contact me if they're interested" or "please sign up for an interview at the fair", then is it reasonable for me to ask them to put me in contact with current teachers now so I can get this info before the fair? Seems like it would be really tough on current teachers if everyone did that. In a prior question I posted on ISR the most common advice I got was to wait to talk to current teachers once I am offered a contract. And that makes sense to me.
Having never been to a job fair, I anticipate it will be rather frenetic and I'm just trying to figure out how to get the info I will need to make the best decision possible. We all know I can't 100% trust what the recruiters tell me.
Thanks in advance for your advice about how you guys handle this.
How to get needed info while at job fair?
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dreamgiver
- Posts: 82
- Joined: Sun Sep 25, 2011 11:00 am
Great question
I will also be going to my first fair...nervous of leaving a public school and going out into the great big world. The conditions of teaching in the
What I have done is taken all the schools listed on this site and color coordinated them. I first deleted countries I would not want as postings. Then researched each one...well not finished but getting there! Bold black got a cover letter and resume, green means more research needed and red not interested. I used reviews from this board and from the search feature on the forum plus other sites to come to my conclusions.
Is it a perfect system? No, but it does give me someplace to start when I get to the fair in Iowa.
P.S. It helps to be an*l retentive! LOL
What I have done is taken all the schools listed on this site and color coordinated them. I first deleted countries I would not want as postings. Then researched each one...well not finished but getting there! Bold black got a cover letter and resume, green means more research needed and red not interested. I used reviews from this board and from the search feature on the forum plus other sites to come to my conclusions.
Is it a perfect system? No, but it does give me someplace to start when I get to the fair in Iowa.
P.S. It helps to be an*l retentive! LOL
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dreamgiver
- Posts: 82
- Joined: Sun Sep 25, 2011 11:00 am
Yeah, I've done somthing similar. Although I did not color code anything! :D I have detailed questions regarding healthcare, insurance, housing, etc that I don't think I can get the answers to without talking to someone currently working at the school. Maybe in another post I will list all the schools I'm currently interested in and see if there are any current teachers on ISR for any of those schools.
Trade?
Please share your list of questions....If there are other posters on here that would like to add to it!
I will start a new thread.....Thanks !
I will start a new thread.....Thanks !
Reality
You sound pretty organized, and the type of person that likes all the information, sadly thats just not the case with international teaching. Your not going to get a chance to talk to any current or previous teachers, your going to have to make the decision without it. Even if you found a person out of luck, would you really want to make your decision on one unknown opinion? A few observations:
1) Being an international teacher requires a certain sense of adventure. Its really unlikely to have the whole picture.
2) Talking with "current teachers" the school provides to you isnt really helpful. They are going to put you in contact with the faculty admins cheerleader. Even if you randomly contacted teachers through the schools website, very few would be comfortable giving you the their version of the "real situation" knowing whatever they tell you could come back to bite them. So just assume anyone the school would give you to contact is going to be all rainbows and sunshine (sort of the opposite of the reviews here on ISR)
3) Every school even the elite schools have problems at some point in time, and no matter how good a school is there will be great teachers who just werent a good fit for that school.
4) In my experience at the fairs, people make their decisions on a contract about two things: money and location. They have preferred regions that if they get an offer they take it. When they have similar schools, it always comes down to the compensation package. More money, tuition waivers, housing allowance, health care, whatever is just more (and more is better). The golden ratio is, Money:Contract hours. How much you get per hour of teaching. Thats really it
1) Being an international teacher requires a certain sense of adventure. Its really unlikely to have the whole picture.
2) Talking with "current teachers" the school provides to you isnt really helpful. They are going to put you in contact with the faculty admins cheerleader. Even if you randomly contacted teachers through the schools website, very few would be comfortable giving you the their version of the "real situation" knowing whatever they tell you could come back to bite them. So just assume anyone the school would give you to contact is going to be all rainbows and sunshine (sort of the opposite of the reviews here on ISR)
3) Every school even the elite schools have problems at some point in time, and no matter how good a school is there will be great teachers who just werent a good fit for that school.
4) In my experience at the fairs, people make their decisions on a contract about two things: money and location. They have preferred regions that if they get an offer they take it. When they have similar schools, it always comes down to the compensation package. More money, tuition waivers, housing allowance, health care, whatever is just more (and more is better). The golden ratio is, Money:Contract hours. How much you get per hour of teaching. Thats really it
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dreamgiver
- Posts: 82
- Joined: Sun Sep 25, 2011 11:00 am
You're partially right, I TRY to be really organized! :) I am a researcher, by nature. Luckily I am also flexible and adventurous, so I'll be okay even if I don't get all the info I want. Thanks Psyguy for the reality check about the fair - it's what I figured was probably going to be the case.
I believe it's true that the names of people the school would give me might be the cheerleaders that would say what they want them to say. Which would be okay to a certain degree since some of my questions wouldn't be affected by that (health insurance, medical care, other practicalities, etc). I don't plan to ask about stuff that I don't trust would be an accurate answer or would only be their opinion anyway. I would like to ask to speak directly to the person in the specialist position I will be replacing (assuming they are vacating the position by their choice).
I just repeatedly read most people saying to make sure to talk to current staff. So I've assumed it must be important. I guess that works for people who get interviewed and offered contracts outside of a fair. Then you're not quite so rushed in making a decision. If I were so lucky as to be offered more than one contract, it would not come down to just money and location to me. While those are two biggies, I would like more specific information about other things that are important to me to help me make up my mind. But it sounds like that's just not reality during the fair. So I'll need to be assertive and do as much research as possible prior to the fair.
I believe it's true that the names of people the school would give me might be the cheerleaders that would say what they want them to say. Which would be okay to a certain degree since some of my questions wouldn't be affected by that (health insurance, medical care, other practicalities, etc). I don't plan to ask about stuff that I don't trust would be an accurate answer or would only be their opinion anyway. I would like to ask to speak directly to the person in the specialist position I will be replacing (assuming they are vacating the position by their choice).
I just repeatedly read most people saying to make sure to talk to current staff. So I've assumed it must be important. I guess that works for people who get interviewed and offered contracts outside of a fair. Then you're not quite so rushed in making a decision. If I were so lucky as to be offered more than one contract, it would not come down to just money and location to me. While those are two biggies, I would like more specific information about other things that are important to me to help me make up my mind. But it sounds like that's just not reality during the fair. So I'll need to be assertive and do as much research as possible prior to the fair.
Perspective
Not to offend you, but teachers are a really bad source to go to for HR type information such as medical and heath care. My experience is teachers dont really understand the systems in place except in how it uniquely effects them. You are much better off asking the HR department or the admin. If an admin is wrong, they will usually try there best to make it right. If a teacher gives you wrong info, your not going to have much recourse. Ask 10 teachers how medical reimbursements work and you'll get 5 answers.
When i got to italy the past teacher who had been there for several years left a two page summary of the classes. Basically a comment about each student. The reality is you most likely (VERY UNLIKELY) wont get a chance to talk to the past teacher.
I'm curious now, what else is important to you?
When i got to italy the past teacher who had been there for several years left a two page summary of the classes. Basically a comment about each student. The reality is you most likely (VERY UNLIKELY) wont get a chance to talk to the past teacher.
I'm curious now, what else is important to you?
Research is good but its been my experience at 4 fairs that you can over plan. At each fair I have attended I have walked out of the fair with jobs at school that I had never researched and the first contact was at the interview sign up. A couple of the schools I had never heard of before walking up to the table.
So do the research but also be open to locations and schools that might not be on your radar until you go to the fair.
So do the research but also be open to locations and schools that might not be on your radar until you go to the fair.
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dreamgiver
- Posts: 82
- Joined: Sun Sep 25, 2011 11:00 am
Overhere - yes, I know you are right about getting to the fairs and having job opportunities I wasn't aware of before getting there. I've heard that happens a lot and I want to be open to those opportunities. That's why I was wondering how I was going to get this information that everyone talks to much about. But you have reinforced what psyguy said, that most likely I just won't be able to get that information at the fair and will have to make a decision without it. That's good to know because now I know to just let it go and pray like crazy to make the best decision! :)
Psyguy - I don't plan to ask HR type questions of current staff. I can ask HR about those things. And obviously I know anything I hear would only be based on that persons experience. However that is more valuable than no information at all. I know in many situations, HR/Director/Principal, will make things sound like perfection so I'd like to have another perspective or two to try and balance things out and help me to read between the lines. I'm assuming this is why everyone says to try and talk to current staff. Plus, some of my questions about insurance and housing are based on some of my personal needs (nothing too major - food & environmental allergies mostly) that I don't want to discuss with the powers that be. These are things that seem like unimportant minute details to most people but could be really helpful to me in making a decision if presented with more than one contract. Luckily being that I am flexible and adventurous I know I will be okay and have a great experience whether I'm able to get this information or not.
I will do as much research as I can about the jobs I am interviewing for by Skype or that I've had personal conversations with the Directors or Principals. I guess that's the best I can do!
Thanks again!
Psyguy - I don't plan to ask HR type questions of current staff. I can ask HR about those things. And obviously I know anything I hear would only be based on that persons experience. However that is more valuable than no information at all. I know in many situations, HR/Director/Principal, will make things sound like perfection so I'd like to have another perspective or two to try and balance things out and help me to read between the lines. I'm assuming this is why everyone says to try and talk to current staff. Plus, some of my questions about insurance and housing are based on some of my personal needs (nothing too major - food & environmental allergies mostly) that I don't want to discuss with the powers that be. These are things that seem like unimportant minute details to most people but could be really helpful to me in making a decision if presented with more than one contract. Luckily being that I am flexible and adventurous I know I will be okay and have a great experience whether I'm able to get this information or not.
I will do as much research as I can about the jobs I am interviewing for by Skype or that I've had personal conversations with the Directors or Principals. I guess that's the best I can do!
Thanks again!