I have a master's in STEM in the US and I've taught as a TA in grad school for 2 years. I realize I need a teaching credential to expand my career options. I am aware that China and Thailand are 2 countries I'm interested in and have lower-tier international schools willing to hire me. I plan to work on a credential while teaching at my first school
I'm already of some differences between Teach Now and Teach Ready. Teach Now offers something like 5 weeks of instructor practice and I can take the PRAXIS exams in Thailand and China. Teach Ready only offers 1 week of practice and I have to return to Florida to take the exams. I also heard that for Teach Now, I have to work at the pace of the other teachers, whereas with Teach Ready I can work at my own pace?
I have some questions
1. If I get hired at a private high school instead of at an international school, how can I complete the 1 week or 5 weeks of instructor practice required for Teach Ready/Teach Now?
2. Is it possible to work on either Teach Ready or Teach Now right now even though I am not currently teaching? And then finish the final parts of it after I accept my first teaching role (probably at a private high school in China or Thailand)?
3. If Teach Ready lets you work on it at your own pace, if I devote 20-25 hrs/wk on it, what do you think is a reasonable time it would take to complete it?
4. Is it true that you only get one chance to pass the exams for Teach Ready? What if you fail one of them? How is it for Teach Now?
5. If I complete the PGCEi, mid and upper-tier international schools in China and Thailand won't recognize it as a valid license, right?
TeachNow vs TeachReady
Response
The field experience for Teach Now is 12 weeks (in module 8) not 5 weeks. Teach Ready is 1 week (5 days). Its not really practice for those 5 days, its observational assessment.
1) Almost all ISs are private/independent DSs. It doesnt really matter, either Teach Now/Teach Ready approves your IS/DS or they dont.
2) Yes, thats what most candidates do, but you will still need access to some kind of IS/DS environment for observations, etc. In addition while Teach Ready is much more flexible, Teach Now uses a cohort model, so youd have to start with the next cohort.
3) 9 months, You cant finish a module until the minimum time has lapsed. This is a state requirement that dictates the number of contact hours for EPP/ITT training. You might finish early, but then you are just waiting.
4) Well kind of. There is no limit to how many attempts you can take to pass the FTCE exams, not one thats imposed by the state at least. The problem is that EPP/ITT programs in FL are assessed on their candidates performance on the PK (professional knowledge) exam. They dont care how many times you need to take a subject test, because thats not what they do. They do care about the PK exam, so in its early days when Teach Ready was very new and had a very small number of candidates (because when youre new you start with zero) each failure by a candidate counted as a failure, so if you have one candidate that needs to take it three times or more, each one of those essentially counts as a candidate who failed, that starts to skew your competency results, and when you have a small sample size, well the outcome at that time was that if you didnt pass your first time you were dropped from the program. Thats much less common now, though Teach ready will always tell you how important the PK exam is and that you should seriously study it, etc. because its what they are measured on, and they dont want failures. You could probably fail it once without too much of an issue, but after your second time your going to have to have a long talk with someone about what your doing wrong, and after a third time its going to be a frank discussion about your suitability as a teacher.
5) In Thailand and China upper tier ISs wont recognize a PGCEi, well they will, but they want QTS and you cant get that directly with a PGCEi. A PGCEi (a PGCE for that matter) isnt a license, or a credential, its a qualification. Many lower and third tier ISs though will treat it as a credential, because they either dont care or dont need to care, or cant afford to care, and there are a lot of them (especially in China).
In China the marketability limits of a PGCEi is 1st tier, and in Thailand its 2nd tier. You can get a lot of work in Asia with a PGCEi and while 1st tier consumes a lot of the focus among the membership, its a very very small part of IE. Even adding the second tier its a small portion.
The locust of the difference between the programs all comes down to what access you have for field experience. The PGCEi works for candidates who dont have access to a classroom because there is no field experience requirement (for a majority of the programs). Teach Ready is for those candidates who dont have a classroom but can get one for a week, which is a much easier sell to leadership and parents when its just a guest IT. For Teach Now you really need an appointment because their field experience at 12 weeks is practically a term. Thats a hard sell to an IS that cares about things like credentials or two parents that are paying big coin for western ITs not some intern making their bones with their children.
1) Almost all ISs are private/independent DSs. It doesnt really matter, either Teach Now/Teach Ready approves your IS/DS or they dont.
2) Yes, thats what most candidates do, but you will still need access to some kind of IS/DS environment for observations, etc. In addition while Teach Ready is much more flexible, Teach Now uses a cohort model, so youd have to start with the next cohort.
3) 9 months, You cant finish a module until the minimum time has lapsed. This is a state requirement that dictates the number of contact hours for EPP/ITT training. You might finish early, but then you are just waiting.
4) Well kind of. There is no limit to how many attempts you can take to pass the FTCE exams, not one thats imposed by the state at least. The problem is that EPP/ITT programs in FL are assessed on their candidates performance on the PK (professional knowledge) exam. They dont care how many times you need to take a subject test, because thats not what they do. They do care about the PK exam, so in its early days when Teach Ready was very new and had a very small number of candidates (because when youre new you start with zero) each failure by a candidate counted as a failure, so if you have one candidate that needs to take it three times or more, each one of those essentially counts as a candidate who failed, that starts to skew your competency results, and when you have a small sample size, well the outcome at that time was that if you didnt pass your first time you were dropped from the program. Thats much less common now, though Teach ready will always tell you how important the PK exam is and that you should seriously study it, etc. because its what they are measured on, and they dont want failures. You could probably fail it once without too much of an issue, but after your second time your going to have to have a long talk with someone about what your doing wrong, and after a third time its going to be a frank discussion about your suitability as a teacher.
5) In Thailand and China upper tier ISs wont recognize a PGCEi, well they will, but they want QTS and you cant get that directly with a PGCEi. A PGCEi (a PGCE for that matter) isnt a license, or a credential, its a qualification. Many lower and third tier ISs though will treat it as a credential, because they either dont care or dont need to care, or cant afford to care, and there are a lot of them (especially in China).
In China the marketability limits of a PGCEi is 1st tier, and in Thailand its 2nd tier. You can get a lot of work in Asia with a PGCEi and while 1st tier consumes a lot of the focus among the membership, its a very very small part of IE. Even adding the second tier its a small portion.
The locust of the difference between the programs all comes down to what access you have for field experience. The PGCEi works for candidates who dont have access to a classroom because there is no field experience requirement (for a majority of the programs). Teach Ready is for those candidates who dont have a classroom but can get one for a week, which is a much easier sell to leadership and parents when its just a guest IT. For Teach Now you really need an appointment because their field experience at 12 weeks is practically a term. Thats a hard sell to an IS that cares about things like credentials or two parents that are paying big coin for western ITs not some intern making their bones with their children.
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santacruzin1
- Posts: 22
- Joined: Mon Dec 07, 2015 6:30 am
Re: TeachNow vs TeachReady
I completed TeacherReady in 2015, so I can answer your questions about that program.
1. You can do the fieldwork for TR as a teacher in your own classroom, and you just need a certified administrator (w/ 3 years experience) or mentor teacher (certified w/ 3 years experience) to supervise the fieldwork assignments and evaluate you during your 1 week of teaching.
2. You can start the program even if you don't have a teaching job; you just won't be able to finish until you have your own classroom or a cooperating school.
3. Unless school was difficult for you or you have poor study habits, 20-25 hours a week for TR is excessive; if you were a good student in school, TR is a breeze. I did the program in exactly 9 months, passed all my exams on the first try, and I certainly did not spend 20-25 hours a week on TR coursework. The field experience/student teaching will take more time, especially when it comes to lesson planning (particularly if your mentor teacher has high standards), but the TR coursework was, frankly, really easy.
4. The exams for TR are the FTCE - the credential exams for the state of Florida. There are 3; general knowledge, professional knowledge, and subject exam (if you're a secondary teacher, the subject you'll be teaching; for primary, a multiple subject exam). You can re-take the exams, but you'll pay a retake fee ($150-$220 depending on the exam), and the exams have to be taken in the USA (any Pearson center in any state), so it may mean another trip back to the USA if you fail one of the exams.
5. No idea about the PGCEi; maybe PsyGuy will be along shortly to tell you more about that.
Hope that helps. The TR staff are really good at answering questions promptly and in detail, I really had only good experiences with their admin before, during, and after the program, so don't be afraid to ask them for more information!
1. You can do the fieldwork for TR as a teacher in your own classroom, and you just need a certified administrator (w/ 3 years experience) or mentor teacher (certified w/ 3 years experience) to supervise the fieldwork assignments and evaluate you during your 1 week of teaching.
2. You can start the program even if you don't have a teaching job; you just won't be able to finish until you have your own classroom or a cooperating school.
3. Unless school was difficult for you or you have poor study habits, 20-25 hours a week for TR is excessive; if you were a good student in school, TR is a breeze. I did the program in exactly 9 months, passed all my exams on the first try, and I certainly did not spend 20-25 hours a week on TR coursework. The field experience/student teaching will take more time, especially when it comes to lesson planning (particularly if your mentor teacher has high standards), but the TR coursework was, frankly, really easy.
4. The exams for TR are the FTCE - the credential exams for the state of Florida. There are 3; general knowledge, professional knowledge, and subject exam (if you're a secondary teacher, the subject you'll be teaching; for primary, a multiple subject exam). You can re-take the exams, but you'll pay a retake fee ($150-$220 depending on the exam), and the exams have to be taken in the USA (any Pearson center in any state), so it may mean another trip back to the USA if you fail one of the exams.
5. No idea about the PGCEi; maybe PsyGuy will be along shortly to tell you more about that.
Hope that helps. The TR staff are really good at answering questions promptly and in detail, I really had only good experiences with their admin before, during, and after the program, so don't be afraid to ask them for more information!
Comment
To comment on @santacruzin1, I dont disagree with any of the post, but would add that there are candidates who did there one week field experience and did little more than follow and deliver the mentoring ITs lesson plan. They didnt have to do any actual planing.
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santacruzin1
- Posts: 22
- Joined: Mon Dec 07, 2015 6:30 am
Re: TeachNow vs TeachReady
@PsyGuy - absolutely right. The field experience/student teaching workload totally depends on who your mentor is. A more laid-back mentor = an easier field experience, a more hands-on/perfectionist mentor = more lesson planning & etc.
I was commenting on the program assignments from TeacherReady, the assignments everyone does regardless of their mentor. Those were a piece of cake & I'd imagine would be for most people with reasonable academic abilities. Certainly nothing near 20-25 hours a week (unless counting student teaching hours in that figure), and I'd estimate closer to 5-10. There were no lengthy writing or research assignments, for example.
I was commenting on the program assignments from TeacherReady, the assignments everyone does regardless of their mentor. Those were a piece of cake & I'd imagine would be for most people with reasonable academic abilities. Certainly nothing near 20-25 hours a week (unless counting student teaching hours in that figure), and I'd estimate closer to 5-10. There were no lengthy writing or research assignments, for example.
Reply
@santacruzin1
I agree, the course work involves very little. You dont even have to really do it, just move through the presenter and keep track of the vocabulary words and echo them back. You could put in an hour after school on your ASP days and do fine (and one IT talked their leadership into making that their ASP).
A number of Teach Ready candidates were essentially substitutes/relief ITs while their mentoring ITs were at PD/conferences for the week. The ITs just left the work and lesson plans and the candidate IT essentially babysat.
I agree, the course work involves very little. You dont even have to really do it, just move through the presenter and keep track of the vocabulary words and echo them back. You could put in an hour after school on your ASP days and do fine (and one IT talked their leadership into making that their ASP).
A number of Teach Ready candidates were essentially substitutes/relief ITs while their mentoring ITs were at PD/conferences for the week. The ITs just left the work and lesson plans and the candidate IT essentially babysat.
Re: TeachNow vs TeachReady
Thanks for the replies
I'm confused about the field experience requirement. What if for my first teaching role I am hired at a private high school, NOT an international school? How can I complete the field experience requirement then?
And what is a DS?
[QUOTE]you just need a certified administrator (w/ 3 years experience) or mentor teacher (certified w/ 3 years experience) to supervise the fieldwork assignments and evaluate you during your 1 week of teaching. [/QUOTE]
So I can complete the field experience requirement at a private high school without having to go to an international school as long as I find a mentor teacher or certified admin with those 3 years experience?
Is it ok to ask them during the Skype interview if they have a teacher or admin who can meet those requirements?
I'm confused about the field experience requirement. What if for my first teaching role I am hired at a private high school, NOT an international school? How can I complete the field experience requirement then?
And what is a DS?
[QUOTE]you just need a certified administrator (w/ 3 years experience) or mentor teacher (certified w/ 3 years experience) to supervise the fieldwork assignments and evaluate you during your 1 week of teaching. [/QUOTE]
So I can complete the field experience requirement at a private high school without having to go to an international school as long as I find a mentor teacher or certified admin with those 3 years experience?
Is it ok to ask them during the Skype interview if they have a teacher or admin who can meet those requirements?
Re: TeachNow vs TeachReady
I just recently learned that with Teach Ready, I actually don't have to be a teacher during the program. Since I've heard alot of bad things about teaching in private high schools or lower-tier international schools, I've been thinking about working a non-teaching job in the US during the 9-month Teach Ready program, and then applying for teaching jobs after I complete the program
If I do this, do you think I will have a shot at mid-tier intl schools? Or do need the credential AND experience first? Does my teaching as a TA in grad school count as experience?
Is it true that mid/upper-tier intl schools don't even count teaching at a private HS or 3rd-tier intl school in China/Thailand anyways?
If I do this, do you think I will have a shot at mid-tier intl schools? Or do need the credential AND experience first? Does my teaching as a TA in grad school count as experience?
Is it true that mid/upper-tier intl schools don't even count teaching at a private HS or 3rd-tier intl school in China/Thailand anyways?
Re: TeachNow vs TeachReady
I forgot to mention, actually I have teaching experience, but it was in grad school when I taught classes for 2 years as a TA. Does that count at all?
Response
@boss14
The vast majority of ISs are essentially private/independent schools. It doesnt really matter as long as the school is accredited by someone legitimate, and there is an appropriate faculty member to mentor you.
DS = Domestic School, it means a school that primarily educates host national (local) students using local DTs (Domestic Teacher).
Yes your field placement can be at a local private DS, and supervised by a local DT.
Yes it would be fine to ask about that, but it would be better to bring this up at the contract negotiation point. It would also be better to ask if the IS would be willing to provide a mentor and briefly describe the requirements.
You dont need to be a teacher during the Teach Ready program at all, this is one of the general benefits of Teach Ready over Teach Now, you do however need access to an IS/DS to do your observations and to do your 5 days of field experience.
I would advise against that approach, nothing in education is a better teacher than experience. You will get to use that bottom tier IT experience as actual experience. One of the challenges in IE is that you generally need two years of post credentialing experience as a bar to entry into IE. You arent going to get certified and have upper tier ISs competing for you, the ISs you are going to be competitive for with a year of experience and newly minted credential arent going to be any or much better that a low tier DS/IS that youd train at anyway. You will also finally be at the stage in your career where mistakes are tolerated more.
No I dont. A credential doesnt move you up a tier, it gets you in the door. Your still going to mostly be marketable to essentially third tier ISs. Generally ITs can move over to a better region or up a tier with each contract cycle (2 years).
It depends on the IS your at, but generally if its accredited by someone and the word ESOL doesnt come up anywhere in your resume or interview it will generally count as experience for step.
TA experience doesnt count.
The vast majority of ISs are essentially private/independent schools. It doesnt really matter as long as the school is accredited by someone legitimate, and there is an appropriate faculty member to mentor you.
DS = Domestic School, it means a school that primarily educates host national (local) students using local DTs (Domestic Teacher).
Yes your field placement can be at a local private DS, and supervised by a local DT.
Yes it would be fine to ask about that, but it would be better to bring this up at the contract negotiation point. It would also be better to ask if the IS would be willing to provide a mentor and briefly describe the requirements.
You dont need to be a teacher during the Teach Ready program at all, this is one of the general benefits of Teach Ready over Teach Now, you do however need access to an IS/DS to do your observations and to do your 5 days of field experience.
I would advise against that approach, nothing in education is a better teacher than experience. You will get to use that bottom tier IT experience as actual experience. One of the challenges in IE is that you generally need two years of post credentialing experience as a bar to entry into IE. You arent going to get certified and have upper tier ISs competing for you, the ISs you are going to be competitive for with a year of experience and newly minted credential arent going to be any or much better that a low tier DS/IS that youd train at anyway. You will also finally be at the stage in your career where mistakes are tolerated more.
No I dont. A credential doesnt move you up a tier, it gets you in the door. Your still going to mostly be marketable to essentially third tier ISs. Generally ITs can move over to a better region or up a tier with each contract cycle (2 years).
It depends on the IS your at, but generally if its accredited by someone and the word ESOL doesnt come up anywhere in your resume or interview it will generally count as experience for step.
TA experience doesnt count.
Re: TeachNow vs TeachReady
Thanks for the reply
Regarding PGCEi, I read somewhere that I can use the PGCEi to apply for a DC credential and then use that to apply for QTS. That's pretty simple, right?
I also read getting a PGCEi looks more impressive than Teach Now/Teach Ready to the parents of students of ISs and thus the reputation of the schools
In that case, is it better to just get the PGCEi compared to Teach Now/Ready?
Regarding PGCEi, I read somewhere that I can use the PGCEi to apply for a DC credential and then use that to apply for QTS. That's pretty simple, right?
I also read getting a PGCEi looks more impressive than Teach Now/Teach Ready to the parents of students of ISs and thus the reputation of the schools
In that case, is it better to just get the PGCEi compared to Teach Now/Ready?
Reply
@boss14
Not likely, in the summer of 2016 DC changed a LOT of their regulations. In the past you could because the regulations allowed for transcript -, they dont anymore for initial credential (now transcript - can only be used for endorsements to a credential). The reason was it cut down drastically on the amount of resources in assessing applications. This year two applicants with a PGCEi were denied standard credentials, one was issued an initial credential the other was denied. The initial credential (entry grade) is a 2 year credential that is non-renewable and wont be accepted by the TCL for QTS.
They are different programs that are attempting different outcomes. A PGCEi is an academic qualification that in the eyes of most parents who arent exactly experts has a long history of being - to a PGCE, which is equated with being an NQT and QTS. Parents just have a lot of assumptions that are complicated Teach Now and Teach Ready are credential training programs they provide a handful of credits of various utility, but they arent academic. A lot of the ISs in the third tier are selling to parents and whatever gets them to pay the coin, in those respects a PGCEi can have more value to an IS than an IT with a credential, but in those cases its really just about bad presentation. The Teach Now/Teach Ready candidate comes out with a state credential, how you got it should not be the focus, but on emphasizing that the IT has a state issued professional educator license.
I really cant say its better. The PGCEi has limitations, but it has solid utility as a working/defacto credential in lower tier ISs. It also the only option that doesnt have any requirement to set foot in a K1/KS classroom. If you have the classroom access to do Teach Now or Teach Ready I would advise you persue those, you will get an actual credential that will get you QTS, and QTS has a lot more value to an IS than a PGCE or PGCEi.
Not likely, in the summer of 2016 DC changed a LOT of their regulations. In the past you could because the regulations allowed for transcript -, they dont anymore for initial credential (now transcript - can only be used for endorsements to a credential). The reason was it cut down drastically on the amount of resources in assessing applications. This year two applicants with a PGCEi were denied standard credentials, one was issued an initial credential the other was denied. The initial credential (entry grade) is a 2 year credential that is non-renewable and wont be accepted by the TCL for QTS.
They are different programs that are attempting different outcomes. A PGCEi is an academic qualification that in the eyes of most parents who arent exactly experts has a long history of being - to a PGCE, which is equated with being an NQT and QTS. Parents just have a lot of assumptions that are complicated Teach Now and Teach Ready are credential training programs they provide a handful of credits of various utility, but they arent academic. A lot of the ISs in the third tier are selling to parents and whatever gets them to pay the coin, in those respects a PGCEi can have more value to an IS than an IT with a credential, but in those cases its really just about bad presentation. The Teach Now/Teach Ready candidate comes out with a state credential, how you got it should not be the focus, but on emphasizing that the IT has a state issued professional educator license.
I really cant say its better. The PGCEi has limitations, but it has solid utility as a working/defacto credential in lower tier ISs. It also the only option that doesnt have any requirement to set foot in a K1/KS classroom. If you have the classroom access to do Teach Now or Teach Ready I would advise you persue those, you will get an actual credential that will get you QTS, and QTS has a lot more value to an IS than a PGCE or PGCEi.