package in china

[sanaanddaddy]

Have been offered a job in China, Beijing and was wondering if anyone could help me out with the standard of the package offered.
It is a start up school with a monthly salary of RMB 33260, free furnished accommodation or RMB 8000 per month allowance. Free schooling for my kids and a 15% (from second year salary, salary goes up each year) bonus at completion of 2 year contract and free medical.

Is this a good salary and package for Beijing?

Thanks

[PsyGuy]

Thats a solid 2nd tier package, with a pretty high housing allowance. Id confirm the quality of the medical. Does it include a relocation package?

[Overhere]

I think the salary is probably right on for a first year at school, but the housing allowance seems a bit low for someone with a family so the provided accommodation might be a better bet.

[sanaanddaddy]

has a summer holiday RMB10,000 travel allowance, US$1000 relocation, RMB 2000 in cash settling in allowance, Medical is world wide coverage for me and family- they said same as other schools use but will look into it a bit more.

Wasn't considering China or Beijing but was contacted by the school and then offered the job, after being in Japan for so long I'm a little nervous to move.

[PsyGuy]

How many kids do you have? If its two youll be able to find a nice 3-4 bedroom on RMB8K.
The travel allowance will basically cover you and thats it.

Id look at the working hours and conditions, youre going to be stepping into a lot of growing pains and frustrations.

[sanaanddaddy]

working hours are the standard 8-4:30. waiting for the official calendar but seems plenty of holidays.

Would like to stay in Japan but the schools here are....... might have soured my name here after blowing the whistle on a head coming to work drunk and a variety of other indiscretions.....

Would love to hear from some teachers living in beijing!

[PsyGuy]

@sanaanddaddy

The same thing happens in China, probably the only major serious complaint is the air quality hazard.

[sanaanddaddy]

i am concerned with the pollution but then again should i really be considering the nuclear air of japan?!

[wrldtrvlr123]

sanaanddaddy wrote:
> i am concerned with the pollution but then again should i really be
> considering the nuclear air of japan?!
===============
The package sounds very solid for Beijing. It sounds very similar to a school in town in Chaoyang. If it is that one then the housing near the school was generally thought to be very good and right across/down the street.

You can't really compare radiation in Japan to pollution in Beijing. The radiation is something to consider but it is open to much interpretation and discussion how much (if any) it will significantly impact your life.

The pollution in Beijing is a fact that even the gov't can't ignore. It will impact your health and quality of life to some extent. The extent of the impact is debatable but it is real. We were there for two years and could have stayed a couple of more but not beyond that. If you can get past what it might be doing to your health (and don't have anyone in the family with respiratory issues) then you could live nice life in Beijing on that package and still probably save some money. The city has lots of good restaurants, shopping, cultural experiences etc and some interesting travel opportunities in area/in country (e.g. Great wall a couple hours away, Xian by night train, etc, Harbin Ice Festival).

It's not someplace I could imagine moving my family to for an extended period of time (as opposed to Japan that we love and don't plan on leaving anytime soon).

[PsyGuy]

@sanaanddaddy

Yes, because one (Beijing) is a real environmental hazard, and the other (Japan) just sounds like one in the media. It would be equivalent to comparing the impact of riding a bicycle into a really heavy bumble bee, and riding a bicycle into a train (this argument assumes you are NOT living in Fukushima, though even if you were the train in Beijing is still bad no matter what). I'll break the science down for you into a really easy to understand tidbit.

1) Radiation kills most effectively by ingestion or inhalation.
2) All the radioactive particles you need to worry about are heavy, they dont stay suspended in the air very long (dont go randomly licking things around Fukushima).
3) All the damaging particles in the air pollution in China are pollution because they are light enough to stay suspended in air.
4) The air pollution in China is mostly chemical.
5) Chemicals are much more lethal than radiation.

Humans handle radiation pretty well, we have to theres a a big orange fusion reactor in the sky all the time. There are two types of damaging radiation ionizing and non-ionizing. The ionizing stuff is bad, the damage to cell DNA and organ failure type of bad. Non-Ionizing not so much, it mostly ends of in the thyroid gland and destroys that leading to dieing (your thyroid is pretty important), we can treat that with iodine (this moves the particles away from the thyroid to be excreted out of the body). Of course your body can only handle so much of this. The great thing about the Fukushima radiation is your not inhaling it, youd have to go around licking things and putting rocks and other stuff in your mouth (I assume you dont do this anyway). Beijing is a lot harder because you have to breath and you need to do it pretty constantly. The problem with that is there are so many compounds in the polluted air, we cant effectively treat them, the only practical solution is filtering them, which you have to do constantly, and short of a hazmat suite isnt 100% effective. Essentially, you can control for the radiation hazard in Japan, its MUCH harder to do that for Beijing.

Lastly, Japan actually cares about the effect and fixing it and the damage. Beijing just cares about reduced productivity.

[sanaanddaddy]

> The package sounds very solid for Beijing. It sounds very similar to a school in town
> in Chaoyang. If it is that one then the housing near the school was generally thought
> to be very good and right across/down the street.
>
> You can't really compare radiation in Japan to pollution in Beijing. The radiation is
> something to consider but it is open to much interpretation and discussion how much
> (if any) it will significantly impact your life.
>
> The pollution in Beijing is a fact that even the gov't can't ignore. It will impact
> your health and quality of life to some extent. The extent of the impact is debatable
> but it is real. We were there for two years and could have stayed a couple of more
> but not beyond that. If you can get past what it might be doing to your health (and
> don't have anyone in the family with respiratory issues) then you could live nice
> life in Beijing on that package and still probably save some money. The city has lots
> of good restaurants, shopping, cultural experiences etc and some interesting travel
> opportunities in area/in country (e.g. Great wall a couple hours away, Xian by night
> train, etc, Harbin Ice Festival).
>
> It's not someplace I could imagine moving my family to for an extended period of time
> (as opposed to Japan that we love and don't plan on leaving anytime soon).


Its more so leaving with the intention of returning to something better. Schools in Japan just don't seem to want to hire from inside the country. Im just lost with the whole lot, and tired of the BS that goes along with it. Having kids and PR doesn't help either. I keep seeing people with 2 years experience hired over me, and then complain that they can't read curricula... I haven't even been able to get an interview with another school for the past 2 years and kind of shot myself in the foot this year by not being able to hold my tongue about the new heads drinking problems......

International schools in Japan have never really recovered from the big shake, just look at how inexperienced the majority of the coordinators and head of departments are in most of the schools!

[sanaanddaddy]

PsyGuy wrote:
> @sanaanddaddy
>
> Yes, because one (Beijing) is a real environmental hazard, and the other
> (Japan) just sounds like one in the media. It would be equivalent to
> comparing the impact of riding a bicycle into a really heavy bumble bee,
> and riding a bicycle into a train (this argument assumes you are NOT living
> in Fukushima, though even if you were the train in Beijing is still bad no
> matter what). I'll break the science down for you into a really easy to
> understand tidbit.
>
> 1) Radiation kills most effectively by ingestion or inhalation.
> 2) All the radioactive particles you need to worry about are heavy, they
> dont stay suspended in the air very long (dont go randomly licking things
> around Fukushima).
> 3) All the damaging particles in the air pollution in China are pollution
> because they are light enough to stay suspended in air.
> 4) The air pollution in China is mostly chemical.
> 5) Chemicals are much more lethal than radiation.
>
> Humans handle radiation pretty well, we have to theres a a big orange
> fusion reactor in the sky all the time. There are two types of damaging
> radiation ionizing and non-ionizing. The ionizing stuff is bad, the damage
> to cell DNA and organ failure type of bad. Non-Ionizing not so much, it
> mostly ends of in the thyroid gland and destroys that leading to dieing
> (your thyroid is pretty important), we can treat that with iodine (this
> moves the particles away from the thyroid to be excreted out of the body).
> Of course your body can only handle so much of this. The great thing about
> the Fukushima radiation is your not inhaling it, youd have to go around
> licking things and putting rocks and other stuff in your mouth (I assume
> you dont do this anyway). Beijing is a lot harder because you have to
> breath and you need to do it pretty constantly. The problem with that is
> there are so many compounds in the polluted air, we cant effectively treat
> them, the only practical solution is filtering them, which you have to do
> constantly, and short of a hazmat suite isnt 100% effective. Essentially,
> you can control for the radiation hazard in Japan, its MUCH harder to do
> that for Beijing.
>
> Lastly, Japan actually cares about the effect and fixing it and the damage.
> Beijing just cares about reduced productivity.


I think you greatly underestimate how serious and unstable the reactor is here! Abe`s dirty law prohibiting it being properly reported on doesn't help either! My friend`s parents farm in Chiba (very far from Fukushima) was quietly, forcibly, shut down last year due to high levels of radiation. There is a really high number of thyroid cancer cancer cases in teens, and its been questioned why that is the only type of cancer that has been publicly researched and reported on. The reactor is still leaking great amounts into the ocean and is beyond repair. Just the other week they sent a set of robots in to do assessments. The robots were supposed to be able to withstand conditions for at least three hours, but didn't even last 30 minutes.

I was initially joking about the pollution and radiation comparison. But in all seriousness, Japan is one semi big earthquake in the northern regions away from being a disaster beyond repair!

[aria]

I think this is a decent salary for Beijing, although you will almost certainly need to supplement that housing allowance. Whilst apartment prices in Beijing are significantly less than here in Shanghai- I pay 8000RMB for my apartment here in Shanghai. It's a 35sqm studio. In Beijing, 8000 may get you a small 2br apartment depending on the area. I think you will have a hard time finding anything modern/updated within that budget. EVERYTHING in China is negotiable, and I don't think it would be considered rude to try to bid for a higher housing allowance.
The pollution is certainly a drawback. Since moving here, I have developed asthma (perhaps partly due to lifestyle- I don't exercise much, and rarely wear my mask). That being said, an air purifier/mask can easily remedy the situation. Not every day is polluted... and I don't think that it should be something that is a deciding factor in moving here- just be responsible about wearing your mask/purchase an air purifier. Beijing is quite a bit worse than Shanghai- but in my opinion, the pollution is getting much better in China than it used to be!
If you have any more questions about living in China, feel free to contact me.

[PsyGuy]

@sanaanddaddy

I think you greatly underestimate the damage of the air pollution in Beijing. Right, there farm was shut down and they were removed because well Japan cares. Beijing couldnt care less as long as loss of productivity is minimized.

Well yeah its higher but it was almost zero before, sure there was and will be some damage, but we are talking of a singular event and its aftermath. Beijing is a constant event, and no ones doing anything about it except publishing DIY plans for building cheap filters with a filter and a fan. Japan is at least studying the problem, Beijing doesnt care.

Yup the reactor is beyond repair, Beijing isnt even trying.

Well that's true that could happen, but breathing Beijing air is worse than smoking. Japan might kill you, Beijing will kill you.

[interteach]

You need to find out if that's after tax or pre-tax on the salary. Even if your school pays Chinese income tax, there's still social tax that gets deducted. You pretty much get it back when you leave, but standard income tax rates are high and if the stated salary is gross rather than net, you need to find out what the net will be, and what other deductions are taken.

The housing allowance is very small.

Does the school sell home air purifiers at cost? What do they do to clean up the air in the school? What kind of medical insurance do you get?