Fresh certification, but no experience....help!!!

[PsyGuy]

@Joe30

I wouldnt say it has to make you a better DT, though it does so much you learn in ITT/EPP is nonsense. It will make you a better DT/IT and being better means your job is easier. The 'good enough' standard changes for ITs as time goes by. Why should an IS continue increasing your coin every year if the lessons are the same. This works longer in municipal DSs but in IE parents are going to have high expectations for the coin they are paying in fees.

Sure your probably going to make it through those two years, but then when your looking to leave your reference is going to reflect that, which admittedly might not be worth much to the next IS that doesnt really care.

This is very true, you can make good coin in third tier ISs, you can also build a house with a hammer and screwdriver. So yes the coin is there, but if you want to add more and better tools to your tool box the time to do it is early in your career in an environment thats more tolerant to mistakes and error. That THB90K is about half what a first year DT can make in the US, and its an LH contract.

@HighHo

I agree the Peace Corp wants members who will go where they are needed most, as thats where your going to make the biggest difference. They arent a recruiting service, its hard work, and immensely frustrating at times.

As a PE IT no one will care about their grade as long as everyone gets high marks. If you flunked someone in PE, there would be a lot of people very upset at you, and likely your grades would just be changed by leadership.

[thefarside]

HighHo wrote:

> I 100% agree with you. Reminds me of a video by Alan Watts where he explains how to
> find happiness in life.
>
> It seems that for one to "make it" in IT, you must get in line and follow
> the herd (pay your dues). This seems like the golden ticket to landing a top job: 2
> years experience in the U.S.A., 2 years experience at tier 1/2 school, no wife or
> kids, a master's degree in education, and look the part (modern haircut, no tattoos,
> no disabilities, white). I'd rather be happy now and walk my own path.

I tend to disagree with this. I don't think there is any 'golden ticket' in IT unless you're talking about teaching area. The HL Math teachers unless they're total degenerates can pretty much write themselves in wherever they want. I have no MA (well I'm working on it), a half sleeve, teaching spouse, arguably not white, and will be moving to a high tier 1 school next year. However, I also teach in a high needish area and from my experience that can make all the difference in the world. I'm sure others have other ideas.

[Thames Pirate]

I would add that the 2yrs in DE plus working your way up in IE isn't always necessary. Some people skip DT, while others never work in lower tier ISs. Sure, the formula is the most common, but I will say again that good teaching is good teaching, and good schools know that.

[wrldtrvlr123]

thefarside wrote:
> HighHo wrote:
>
> > I 100% agree with you. Reminds me of a video by Alan Watts where he explains how
> to
> > find happiness in life.
> >
> > It seems that for one to "make it" in IT, you must get in line and
> follow
> > the herd (pay your dues). This seems like the golden ticket to landing a top
> job: 2
> > years experience in the U.S.A., 2 years experience at tier 1/2 school, no wife
> or
> > kids, a master's degree in education, and look the part (modern haircut, no
> tattoos,
> > no disabilities, white). I'd rather be happy now and walk my own path.
>
> I tend to disagree with this. I don't think there is any 'golden ticket' in IT
> unless you're talking about teaching area. The HL Math teachers unless they're total
> degenerates can pretty much write themselves in wherever they want. I have no MA
> (well I'm working on it), a half sleeve, teaching spouse, arguably not white, and
> will be moving to a high tier 1 school next year. However, I also teach in a high
> needish area and from my experience that can make all the difference in the world.
> I'm sure others have other ideas.
==============================
It's also based on so many false assumptions I lost track. Many of us have very successful (and enjoyable) teaching careers/lives with wives, kids, bad haircuts, the odd tattoo, etc. You don't need to be a stepford teacher.

It also seems very hard for some people to accept that many of us actually enjoy teaching and our students and take great satisfaction from spending time with them and doing a good job. For many of us it's a worthy career and not just a way to be able to earn enough money to live overseas. But you can't explain color to the blind or shame the shameless.

[joe30]

@PsyGuy

Well, they should continue increasing pay for each year of experience because that's what the market does.

In a lot of third tier IS's parents are going to be told what they want to hear in order to keep them happy. An easier job where you get no support (IS) is still easier than a difficult job where you get support (DS).

@wrldtrvlr123

I'll assume that last paragraph is aimed at me. I don't see why it's 'shameful' to do a job for the cash and lifestyle. That's what the vast majority of workers across the world do. Do you think 95%+ of workers in the world should be ashamed?

[OzGrad]

The point is that a School is not a typical business. (Even if some treat it this way)

If your children were attending a school would you want them taught by someone who cared about your child's education, or would you be happy with someone that just turned up and did the bare minimum?

[PsyGuy]

Its true some ITs skip DE entirely and in certain scenarios such as your field being hyper saturated and youd have to wait years to possibly get an appointment in DE than IE first makes a lot of sense. That doesnt mitigate the loss in mentoring and resourcing an intern class IT is missing from not completing induction. Your not going to pick that time up just because your job prospects in DE are very low. Its still going to be sink or swim. ID rather do that in water with a lifeguard, a mentor, and possibly water I can touch the bottom in then being pushed overboard in the deep water with nothing. Sure that mentor might not be worth anything and the lifeguard may be napping behind their sunglasses, etc. but hose are risks that just dont exist in IE at all (with the caveat that some ISs really do run great intern programs). We will probably debate the value of that induction period for quite some time. You may end up with a horrible experience in DE or IE, but your probability of growing professionally and having the mentoring and resources available to do that are better in DE than IE.

I would disagree with @Thames Pirate that good ISs and good leadership know what good teaching is. Those that can do, and those that cant teach, and those who cant teach are administration. Im sure all of us know of someone in administration who is there because administration is the place they could do the least damage.

Im sure @WT123 would also agree that there is also that population of ITs/DTs that are just in it for the coin and are just waiting to retire out, and that at one point loved working with children and now they just want to get through the day and the week and to summer break until they dont have to do it anymore. That there is also another population that got into education because it was a job, that they couldnt monetize in the business world, and they didnt "make it" to the top, and teaching is about as good as they are going to get for a gig that comes with steady coin and benefits.

Well @Joe30 they increase the salary scale in the market because the underlying assumption is that more experience translates to increased skill, expertise in an ITs classroom and thats going to equate to increased performance and learning because thats how labor works.
Sure, their are ISs that are so bogged down in ancient meds/peds, that a white face with a pulse can turn pages ina book and hand out worksheets and exams for quite a long time. Understand that at a certain point you cant turn around and go back and do everything you should have done at the beginning of your career. There is no time limit on when you can do induction for QTS but your going to find it increasingly difficult to do as your career ages.

Thats not true @OzGrad, there are a lot of ISs that are run exactly like a business. The issue is are those parents going to know the differences between the bare minimum and an IT that can put on a caring face for parents when they have to.

[alet3233]

Where do you find job openings for NQT's? I've been looking around and haven't had much luck finding them.

[joe30]

Just apply for anything that you like the look of. They'll be in touch if they want to speak to you.

[PsyGuy]

@alet3233

TES (Times Education Supplement), originally in print media, its been around since 1910 and can be found here:

http://www.tes.co.uk/jobs

Its really just too early, as Spring gets later there will be a vast increase in vacancies posted as summer approaches.