This is mainly geared to US citizens living abroad since the college costs there are stupid ridiculous. We're still a few years away until our child will be graduating, but we've been having this discussion on what to do if and when our child decides to go to college. If we decide to remain overseas until the kid graduates, then we are really stuck in terms of being able to help him afford the exorbitant costs of US universities. We are not official residents of any state and do not own any property so claiming in-state tuition is not a possibility. Additionally, one must establish at least one year of residency in a state before in-state tuition rates can be credited. Numbers vary a bit, but the average cost per year based on in-state tuition is $9K, out-of state-tuition is around $25k and a private is around $34K--this is tuition only; room, board, and general living expenses are extra. We put money away each month in a 529 account, but even then it would be very difficult to afford a public university out-of-state, let alone a private school for an entire four years.
One option is looking at universities in Europe or Canada, where the tuition is a bit cheaper. Obviously scholarships are another possibility but there is no guarantee he would receive them. I really would like to avoid having the kid take on any major student loans--it really stinks to start out one's career in thousands of dollars of debt.
Another, perhaps more obvious option would be to move back to the US a year or two before the kid's graduation and establish residency--but it would also mean pulling the him out of IS to a DS in the middle or near the end of his high school years simply due to college costs.
Have any of you parents, particularly those who are US citizens, faced this dilemma with your kids? If so, what did you do?
Affording College Costs in the US
Response
There is a lot of variability among the responses available, mainly that states define residents differently for purposes of tuition classification. Some have more lax requirements and some much more rigid. The main issues are in how to define "presence" and "intent". Some states require you maintain physical presence within their state borders to qualify as a domiciled resident, some states mearly only require to show intent (which can be proven a number of ways) in maintaining that state as your domiciled residence. For some a drivers license and a post office box would be sufficient, for others state tax returns are required, and for others the ownership or lease of real property is required.
Where are you now and where do you intend to be? If an EU Uni is something you are open too, than you have some time to position yourself in such a location but timing will be critical, otherwise you have the same issue of uprooting your child before they complete their school leaving program. The advantage is that if you are resident you could attend Uni for little to no cost (part of those really high taxes).
Depending on your current location a regional university may be an option. A number of flagship national universities have English degree programs in a number of subjects, and they may be very affordable.
Another option is looking at a EU region such as Norther Europe for example where foreign tuition is about USD10K a year which would be at about what you would pay for instate resident tuition.
Finally, you may want to look into an online Uni or college, typically ones in the states offer out of state participants these programs at closer to in state tuition rates.
Where are you now and where do you intend to be? If an EU Uni is something you are open too, than you have some time to position yourself in such a location but timing will be critical, otherwise you have the same issue of uprooting your child before they complete their school leaving program. The advantage is that if you are resident you could attend Uni for little to no cost (part of those really high taxes).
Depending on your current location a regional university may be an option. A number of flagship national universities have English degree programs in a number of subjects, and they may be very affordable.
Another option is looking at a EU region such as Norther Europe for example where foreign tuition is about USD10K a year which would be at about what you would pay for instate resident tuition.
Finally, you may want to look into an online Uni or college, typically ones in the states offer out of state participants these programs at closer to in state tuition rates.
-
Thames Pirate
- Posts: 1150
- Joined: Fri Jul 05, 2013 8:06 am
Re: Affording College Costs in the US
Actually, many in Europe are free even to foreigners (excepting some minimal fees and possibly housing costs), even if you don't live in the EU.
-
Helen Back
- Posts: 242
- Joined: Fri Dec 28, 2012 4:16 pm
Re: Affording College Costs in the US
The cost of tuition is a major issue for expat Brits as well now. I keep hearing about free tuition in other countries or alternative routes to a first degree. I think this would a great subject for ISR to pick up on and investigate.
Reply
@teller
To clarify there are many Unis in the EU that are free as far as tuition fees are concerned even for foreign students. This is starting to change though and there is a growing number of Unis that are charging increased fees for those who are not resident.
The crux of the discussion is that if you return to the US and your child resides with you they wont have any room/board costs, but if you send them to the Eu they will have room/board costs which with fees will come out to about USD$10K or about the same as you would pay in just tuition fees in the US.
A further concern is that at the undergrad/first degree level many of these programs are taught in the host language (though English programs are growing).
To clarify there are many Unis in the EU that are free as far as tuition fees are concerned even for foreign students. This is starting to change though and there is a growing number of Unis that are charging increased fees for those who are not resident.
The crux of the discussion is that if you return to the US and your child resides with you they wont have any room/board costs, but if you send them to the Eu they will have room/board costs which with fees will come out to about USD$10K or about the same as you would pay in just tuition fees in the US.
A further concern is that at the undergrad/first degree level many of these programs are taught in the host language (though English programs are growing).
Re: Affording College Costs in the US
We have 1 graduating college this year and 1 starting college next fall. Our oldest attended a private college so there's no in/out state tuition issue. We ended up paying about $7000 a year out of pocket for a $40,000 a year college due to scholarships. Many private colleges with high costs on paper offer more money in grants and support than public universities that have a lower cost on paper. My niece in Iowa was accepted to 4 private colleges there and her out of pocket costs at all of them would be around $10K and all are in the $45-50,000 annual range.
My 2nd child has the grades for some private schools, but nothing that would earn him money like that to offset the costs. We own property in MN but still have to apply for residency because we live out of the country. Each state (and in some cases each school in a state) sets its own residency requirements. One that is pretty flexible is Utah. There are some colleges (public) that don't count in/out of state tuition--Bemidji State in MN is one where all students pay the same rate.
My take-away is that it can be done--but you have to be very savvy and realistic. Starting early and having conversations about what is realistic early on is really important. This turned out to be really important for our family, where our kids are surrounded by classmates who don't have to factor costs into any of their college decisions because of their wealth. We worked hard to save and can afford to send our kids to a state university for 4 years and not have to take out loans, so that (for us) was the benchmark--anything more than that would require scholarships or financial aid to make up the difference. We are not willing to take out any significant loans, so we had to investigate how loans work, who has to sign for them, payment schemes, etc., so that we could tell our kids exactly what was available to them. We had to do a LOT of work on our part to set those parameters. Their college searches had to be limited to schools that met that criteria. Both of our kids have had to give up their first choice for financial reasons, but that's how it is. It was better for them to know those limits up front, rather than have them apply and set their hearts on a school and we scramble or struggle or have to say no at the point that they had picked that one "perfect" college.
Another option is community colleges--if you have family or friends your child can live with, that can work to defray the costs. There are some community colleges that do have housing--they can be hard to find, but they do exist.
I found that I had to do a lot more work on my own with financial searches and community colleges. International schools are largely feeding all of their students into college (or gap years) so a kid who is more financially needy or maybe is not quite ready for college--counselors don't seem to have that experience that counselors in the US might have.
My 2nd child has the grades for some private schools, but nothing that would earn him money like that to offset the costs. We own property in MN but still have to apply for residency because we live out of the country. Each state (and in some cases each school in a state) sets its own residency requirements. One that is pretty flexible is Utah. There are some colleges (public) that don't count in/out of state tuition--Bemidji State in MN is one where all students pay the same rate.
My take-away is that it can be done--but you have to be very savvy and realistic. Starting early and having conversations about what is realistic early on is really important. This turned out to be really important for our family, where our kids are surrounded by classmates who don't have to factor costs into any of their college decisions because of their wealth. We worked hard to save and can afford to send our kids to a state university for 4 years and not have to take out loans, so that (for us) was the benchmark--anything more than that would require scholarships or financial aid to make up the difference. We are not willing to take out any significant loans, so we had to investigate how loans work, who has to sign for them, payment schemes, etc., so that we could tell our kids exactly what was available to them. We had to do a LOT of work on our part to set those parameters. Their college searches had to be limited to schools that met that criteria. Both of our kids have had to give up their first choice for financial reasons, but that's how it is. It was better for them to know those limits up front, rather than have them apply and set their hearts on a school and we scramble or struggle or have to say no at the point that they had picked that one "perfect" college.
Another option is community colleges--if you have family or friends your child can live with, that can work to defray the costs. There are some community colleges that do have housing--they can be hard to find, but they do exist.
I found that I had to do a lot more work on my own with financial searches and community colleges. International schools are largely feeding all of their students into college (or gap years) so a kid who is more financially needy or maybe is not quite ready for college--counselors don't seem to have that experience that counselors in the US might have.
-
interteach
- Posts: 210
- Joined: Wed Nov 29, 2006 2:25 pm
Re: Affording College Costs in the US
Mamava has lots of good advice. A good college counselor at an international school will be familiar with US schools that are generous with financial aid. You might want to have an early discussion at your current location with the college counselor to see what they may know and be able to help you with. It's not guaranteed, but not all kids who attend international schools (even really expensive ones) can pay their way to the US. I
Re: Affording College Costs in the US
Do not go to school is the US. They are 3x the price of universities in the UK and Europe...
-
shadowjack
- Posts: 2140
- Joined: Sat Oct 06, 2012 9:49 am
Re: Affording College Costs in the US
Or, have your kid move back to where the in-state school is for a year, apply to uni, and go as an in-state resident. There is that option, with a year to work, earn money, and figure out life on the other side of the world/coin from mom and dad.
-
eion_padraig
- Posts: 408
- Joined: Sat Dec 11, 2010 8:18 pm
Re: Affording College Costs in the US
I've worked with students who chose military service in the form of attending US military academies (granted that was back in the US; I'd need to research how they get appointments while abroad) or going for ROTC scholarships. Obviously not all students or families would choose that route. There was also a scholarship opportunity that was offered by the DoD that I came across several years ago for STEM majors where you'd work for DoD after graduation. Kind of like military service, but specifically for scientists.
ShadowJack is right is hitting on what I see as a possibility for kids and I've recommended in a few cases to faculty kids and even for US citizens whose families told them the student needed to self-fund themselves for college and had no state residency. Students go back to the US and get a job, live for a year or two to establish residency. Some states it will require over a year. You basically need to show that you didn't move to the state with the intention of going to university there.
The problem is that US states have tightened up the process of getting in-state residency a whole lot as a way to get more tuition revenue from out of state students. Some like University of Alabama have made a real go of it by specifically recruiting out of state students to get strong students and more money. There was a mainstream article on it somewhere within the last few months.
If your child is very strong relative to the school's applicant pool and the school offers large merit money, there can be a significant discount from the sticker price. But in this case you trade prestige for lower cost of attendance. I think "The College Solution" by Lynn O'Shaughnessy does a good job of discussing how to look for affordability in colleges. It's a bit old now (2008), but she breaks down the process in understandable ways. She clearly talked with and understood what admission and financial aid people where telling her.
Canada is a good option for affordability, but they don't tend to offer big scholarships so you tend to pay the sticker price for international students. It's possible to get down to their costs with US universities if you're thoughtful about where applications are going. It's better when the Canadian dollar is weak relative to the US dollar.
Mamva hits it on the head that setting the expectations early with the kids is key. I find with our students, that the kids whose parents are not teachers have a lot more money to spend on university. It's very easy for them to get their heart set on a school that isn't going to be possible from a financial standpoint. One of the college reps from Utah was visiting and it was clear they're willing to give in state rates to out of state students.
Generally focus on states where the population is shrinking, people don't want to go to the state school and the state universities that don't attract a lot of outside students. It helps if they're also terrible at football and basketball. So Idaho, Nebraska, and West Virginia will most likely be better than Texas, Virginia, and California as far as state options go.
I've still yet to find a free/almost free option in Europe that is an option for an undergraduate studying in English. People talk about Northern Europe. However, Germany, as an example has very specific IB requirements to be able to enter their universities. There is also a myth out there that there are all these scholarships out there that go unclaimed. That's BS. Most of the scholarships offered by universities are a matter of them discounting their tuition to get some tuition revenue. There are lots of small scholarships offered by community organizations and whatnot, but they're usually for tiny amounts and often take time and energy to apply for. Most money a US student will receive in scholarships will come from the school that they attend or the US government if they qualify. Large, outside scholarships are rare and unless the kid is exceptional, they are not likely to win them.
I would hesitate to recommend any option that overloads a kid with debt. By overloading I mean that they take out more in loans (even relatively low interest loans - Subsidized/Unsubsidized Federal Loans) than their yearly salary will be once they graduate. You can't unload student loans in bankruptcy in the US.
ShadowJack is right is hitting on what I see as a possibility for kids and I've recommended in a few cases to faculty kids and even for US citizens whose families told them the student needed to self-fund themselves for college and had no state residency. Students go back to the US and get a job, live for a year or two to establish residency. Some states it will require over a year. You basically need to show that you didn't move to the state with the intention of going to university there.
The problem is that US states have tightened up the process of getting in-state residency a whole lot as a way to get more tuition revenue from out of state students. Some like University of Alabama have made a real go of it by specifically recruiting out of state students to get strong students and more money. There was a mainstream article on it somewhere within the last few months.
If your child is very strong relative to the school's applicant pool and the school offers large merit money, there can be a significant discount from the sticker price. But in this case you trade prestige for lower cost of attendance. I think "The College Solution" by Lynn O'Shaughnessy does a good job of discussing how to look for affordability in colleges. It's a bit old now (2008), but she breaks down the process in understandable ways. She clearly talked with and understood what admission and financial aid people where telling her.
Canada is a good option for affordability, but they don't tend to offer big scholarships so you tend to pay the sticker price for international students. It's possible to get down to their costs with US universities if you're thoughtful about where applications are going. It's better when the Canadian dollar is weak relative to the US dollar.
Mamva hits it on the head that setting the expectations early with the kids is key. I find with our students, that the kids whose parents are not teachers have a lot more money to spend on university. It's very easy for them to get their heart set on a school that isn't going to be possible from a financial standpoint. One of the college reps from Utah was visiting and it was clear they're willing to give in state rates to out of state students.
Generally focus on states where the population is shrinking, people don't want to go to the state school and the state universities that don't attract a lot of outside students. It helps if they're also terrible at football and basketball. So Idaho, Nebraska, and West Virginia will most likely be better than Texas, Virginia, and California as far as state options go.
I've still yet to find a free/almost free option in Europe that is an option for an undergraduate studying in English. People talk about Northern Europe. However, Germany, as an example has very specific IB requirements to be able to enter their universities. There is also a myth out there that there are all these scholarships out there that go unclaimed. That's BS. Most of the scholarships offered by universities are a matter of them discounting their tuition to get some tuition revenue. There are lots of small scholarships offered by community organizations and whatnot, but they're usually for tiny amounts and often take time and energy to apply for. Most money a US student will receive in scholarships will come from the school that they attend or the US government if they qualify. Large, outside scholarships are rare and unless the kid is exceptional, they are not likely to win them.
I would hesitate to recommend any option that overloads a kid with debt. By overloading I mean that they take out more in loans (even relatively low interest loans - Subsidized/Unsubsidized Federal Loans) than their yearly salary will be once they graduate. You can't unload student loans in bankruptcy in the US.
Discussion
Some good advice, you basically have to game the system in the US if your state of interest has high standards for how it defines residency. The issue with states that no one wants to live in is that no one wants to go to Uni there either, which reduces the value of the degree.
Community of Junior colleges have similar issues. You can go to a CC cheap for 2 years but then you have less options on where to transfer either your going to a no name state Uni or your losing so many credits going to a Uni with some status that it doesnt save you much.
Is a military academy an option, sure if you want to go into the military.
Its also difficult to find a truly free Uni in the EU, you can get very cheap tuition but theres always a trade off for something like housing or the English program has comparable tuition rates as anywhere else.
Community of Junior colleges have similar issues. You can go to a CC cheap for 2 years but then you have less options on where to transfer either your going to a no name state Uni or your losing so many credits going to a Uni with some status that it doesnt save you much.
Is a military academy an option, sure if you want to go into the military.
Its also difficult to find a truly free Uni in the EU, you can get very cheap tuition but theres always a trade off for something like housing or the English program has comparable tuition rates as anywhere else.
-
Thames Pirate
- Posts: 1150
- Joined: Fri Jul 05, 2013 8:06 am
Re: Affording College Costs in the US
Lots of countries have free tuition, though most have fees (generally less than $1000 and often half that). Germany, France, and Norway come to mind, though the trick is either speaking the local language or finding a program in that language. Also, you do have to figure out cost of living. Argentina and Taiwan also allegedly have reasonable prices, though not like Europe.
reply
@Thames Pirate
Its not free when its all in. Either you have to pay for housing and fees, or the English program has exclusive fees. Hence, the UK as the most viable option since courses are delivered in English. I suppose the advice could be start studying a language like French since its a romance language. Norwegian is a very difficult language to learn.
You might as well look at one of the Uni that are offering programs in China.
Its not free when its all in. Either you have to pay for housing and fees, or the English program has exclusive fees. Hence, the UK as the most viable option since courses are delivered in English. I suppose the advice could be start studying a language like French since its a romance language. Norwegian is a very difficult language to learn.
You might as well look at one of the Uni that are offering programs in China.
-
Thames Pirate
- Posts: 1150
- Joined: Fri Jul 05, 2013 8:06 am
Re: Affording College Costs in the US
It isn't all in. It's free tuition, a few small fees, and then you're on your own for housing, etc.
There are a number of programs in countries like Germany and France and even Norway that are in English. The language is not harder than any other--it is a Germanic language like English (though a different branch, I believe). It's supposed to be one of the easier languages for English speakers to learn, though I have never tried. A couple of friends said it isn't that hard.
Many of those are still cheaper than the UK, which is still cheaper than the US.
There are a number of programs in countries like Germany and France and even Norway that are in English. The language is not harder than any other--it is a Germanic language like English (though a different branch, I believe). It's supposed to be one of the easier languages for English speakers to learn, though I have never tried. A couple of friends said it isn't that hard.
Many of those are still cheaper than the UK, which is still cheaper than the US.