Istanbul

senator
Posts: 384
Joined: Tue Sep 19, 2006 1:53 am

Istanbul

Post by senator »

How is the quality of life in Istanbul? Food? Cost of living? Travel? Air, water quality?

Anything would be appreciated.
SofaKing
Posts: 9
Joined: Fri Dec 09, 2016 1:32 pm

Re: Istanbul

Post by SofaKing »

Quality of life
You can live very well on the salaries that international schools pay here. There are a multitude of options for dining out/socialising/sightseeing etc.

Food?
The food is quite good. Many rave about it but personally I'd say it's solid but unremarkable. Fresh produce is of the highest quality and very cheap when in season. Fresh fruit/veg shops are everywhere. Turkish breakfasts are top class but other than that I'd say it's pretty average. Every eatery delivers right to your door to if you don't fancy going out to eat.

Cost of living?
Quite low. Accommodation is getting more expensive but school stipends should still cover it - especially if you are part of a teaching couple. Eating out is cheap. You could quite easily eat out every night of the week and still not break the bank. In saying that, Istanbul has everything from your corner kebab guy to high end restaurants. The local currency is very weak now (down somewhere around 20% of it's value against the dollar over the last 6 months) and most schools pay in dollars as far as I know.

Travel?
Istanbul is a travel hub, both domestically and internationally. There are no shortage of holiday destinations in-country, and you are on the doorstep of Europe/North Africa/the Middle East here. I don't think you could be more ideally placed to travel.

Air, water quality?
Air is pretty clean for the most part. It can get a bit dusty but that hasn't been much of an issue for me. Water quality - most people drink from bottled water here. It's very cheap. Apparently you can drink from the taps but not many people do.

Istanbul and Turkey have garnered a lot of attention over the past 6 months to 1 year due to political turmoil, bombings, the attempted coup, Syrian refugees etc. I honestly feel safe here but others may feel differently. It's not for everyone but if you have any other specific questions, feel free to PM me.
Yantantether
Posts: 168
Joined: Tue Apr 10, 2012 12:41 am

Re: Istanbul

Post by Yantantether »

Not wanting to cause due alarm but I'd think long and hard about Istanbul. Turkey is extremely unstable on many fronts at the moment. Recent bombings (of which there have been many) include the international airport and the main tourist area. Yes, no place is completely safe but less so Istanbul, and Turkey in general right now. That aside, probably a great place to live for a few years.
global_nomad
Posts: 72
Joined: Thu Jan 07, 2016 12:12 pm

Re: Istanbul

Post by global_nomad »

Too bad! Always wanted to work in Istanbul.
Carlson on the roof
Posts: 2
Joined: Sat Dec 10, 2016 6:44 am

Re: Istanbul

Post by Carlson on the roof »

Upward of 20 + jobs posted on Search for Istanbul Schools, many with fantastic savings potential. It is all about mitigating risk. Although traffic is a severe problem the air quality is nothing like China. Climate is pleasant and seasonal with a little snow in winter and plenty of sunny days. Fantastic travel opportunities, Turkish airlines will take some beating in terms of their frequent flyer programme and destinations served.

If you're single and looking to put cash in the bank then certainly worth considering.
PsyGuy
Posts: 10789
Joined: Wed Oct 12, 2011 9:51 am
Location: Northern Europe

Response

Post by PsyGuy »

What are you looking for this time @senator?

My issues with @sofaking arent really inaccuracies, but lack context and perspective, to comment on the following:

Food: Traditional Turkish cousin is very uninspired it borrows some from the ME and some from India, but its grilled meet on a pita. yes there is an availability of a wide range of cuisine, but this is Istanbul, and the same would be true of any capital metro/cosmo city.
Produce is fine when its in season, otherwise its the same as other imports, it came a long way to get to your table. The delivery is very convenient, you dont even have to ask, as everywhere will deliver. Breakfasts are okay, Ive had better in France and worse in many places. The value can be good you get more for what youd pay for a continental breakfast in many places, but Ill take a French croissant from a cafe in Nice or crepes and lingonberries sauce in Malmo or a ristretto doupe espresso in Milan then what many would brag is a top notch Turkish breakfast.

Quality of Life: You can live well on the coin at some of the ISs, but again these would be true of most upper tier ISs. Nightlife is more accessible compared to the ME, but you ahve to have more than IT coin to be socially competitive in that social scene. Shiba girls take a lot to impress.

Cost of Living: It can be low, but anyone who wants to maintain a western lifestyle is going to be paying for it at significant coin. About the only real efficiency is that you generally get good space for your coin, but living in a trendy modern high rise isnt going to be cheap. Most ISs will cover modern housing, but thats what they are supposed to do.

Travel: Travel hub compared to what? HK, LON, NRT, BKK only in someone at Turkish airlines dreams. Youd be a lot more centrally located in Brussels to the all of WE than you would in Istanbul. Most of the major capital cities LON, Rome, Paris have better options than Istanbul. Turkish airlines isnt that great either, still better than United, but otherwise meh. Its also a lot cheaper flying on the ULC carriers throughout the WE. I wont brag about Ryanair, butt hen again I can put up with a lot of discomfort for an hour or less for about the coin of a bottle of vino.

Air and Water: Its supposed to be clean. True many people drink from bottle water but thats becoming more true of everywhere, especially among the affluent.

So what amounts to a lot of average is fine until you consider the political environment, why put yourself in that scenario for a whole lot of average?
Vagabond5
Posts: 1
Joined: Wed Dec 21, 2016 1:39 pm

Re: Istanbul

Post by Vagabond5 »

I live in Istanbul and so can provide some information.

It is true that the situation in Istanbul/Turkey sounds scary. However, on the ground in Istanbul you don't really notice it as much as one might think. People are pretty much just getting on with their lives. The violence has had devastating consequences for the Turks and so many family business have closed -- sad. Even though daily life feels pretty normal, if you are an international newbie or prone to anxiety I'd suggest you not come. You will notice that when you're stuck in a crowd, or having to pass by an area with lots of police that your heart rate goes up a bit and nervousness sets in and that's no fun.

Istanbul is not a cheap city. That said, if you are single you'll be able to save and travel on an IS salary. Be prepared to drop some cash to get set up in your new place, be that school provided or self chosen. School provided places are barely outfitted and so bland that teachers generally feel the need to purchase items to "round them out". If you want live in your own place, expect the rent to be $500 or more for a decent one bedroom.

Traffic in Istanbul is a nightmare! Many don't care to use the metro at the moment, but it and the ferries are pretty much the only way to move around the city easily. That said, the metro stations are few and far between so you'll likely be stuck in a taxi trying to get to the metro. Taxis are cheap and everywhere!

Travel from Istanbul is cheap and easy. You can fly just about anywhere from Istanbul and for decent prices. For instance a roundtrip ticket to Rome is about $150, to London $140. Within Turkey you can travel very cheaply and there are truly some fantastic destinations.

For a city of 17-million, Istanbul is amazingly shy of anything remotely resembling culinary diversity. There are thousands of cafes and restaurants -- all of which serve largely the exact same things! You can easily find produce (nice selection year-round) and other items to cook at home. And, as mentioned you can literally have ANYTHING delivered to your door - items from the pet shop, the pharmacy, the liquor store, restaurants, groceries... . You cannot drink the water and must buy bottled water.

On a random note, if you are a person who needs greenery, has bad knees or is really out of shape you might want to pass on Istanbul. It is a very hilly city and you will climb a lot of stairs/hills. There is very little in the way of green here - parks are few and far between. Air quality is generally fine, although in the winter one sometimes encounters a bit of coal smoke (and there is a lot of cigarette smoke!!).

Lastly, the Turkish people are so lovely. Once you settle into your neighborhood and start visiting the grocer, baker, coffee shop on a regular basis you will be warmly accepted (if you also extend a friendly hand).
reisgio
Posts: 206
Joined: Sat Oct 18, 2014 10:17 am

Re: Istanbul

Post by reisgio »

What a disgrace that anyone on this forum should be an apologist for Turkey. Beyond conducting massive purges of government officials and teachers, the government has jailed its opponents and aided and abetted Islamists, who just this week, ended up chaining two Turkish soldiers to the ground before making them walk like dogs on all fours before finally burning them alive. Just this week a Turkish guard assassinated a Russian ambassador. Not a country any international teacher should consider until current duplicitous and dangerous regime is history.
SofaKing
Posts: 9
Joined: Fri Dec 09, 2016 1:32 pm

Re: Istanbul

Post by SofaKing »

A nice, balanced perspective, Reisgio.
PsyGuy
Posts: 10789
Joined: Wed Oct 12, 2011 9:51 am
Location: Northern Europe

Comment

Post by PsyGuy »

@SofaKing

It doesnt have to be balanced to be accurate.
senator
Posts: 384
Joined: Tue Sep 19, 2006 1:53 am

Re: Istanbul

Post by senator »

Reisgio,

So, do you recommend Istanbul or not?
senator
Posts: 384
Joined: Tue Sep 19, 2006 1:53 am

Re: Istanbul

Post by senator »

Ok. I just got offered a job in Istanbul.

What would a good salary/benefit package be?

I have no problem turning down the job. No problem at all.
reisgio
Posts: 206
Joined: Sat Oct 18, 2014 10:17 am

Re: Istanbul

Post by reisgio »

I am not going to condone this by providing a response. It's your life, but I don't have to facilitate.
PsyGuy
Posts: 10789
Joined: Wed Oct 12, 2011 9:51 am
Location: Northern Europe

Reply

Post by PsyGuy »

@senator

Comp: Top of the third tier is USD$30K, 2nd tier is USD$35K, 1st tier USD$40K and elite is USD$45K. Id push for the IS to absorb the tax as part of comp.
OSH Package would include:
1) Visa/Documentation. Theres a brief medical exam on arrival that if the IS requires they should absorb the cost, its basically a blood test.
2) RTA at start and end of contract (1st tier would give RTA at resigning, and elite tier would be open to annual RTA).
3) Housing provided directly, an IS that provided an allowance to a new IT would be a big give, as the IS would be absorbing a significant amount of facilitation costs to get you moved in. It would be reasonable to negotiate a housing allowance after the first year or at renewal.
4) A retirement benefit that provides at least a 10% contribution, with no more than 2 year vesting requirement. Middle tier ISs will just provide a bonus, higher tier ISs will have a private portfolio product, but dont expect a lot of complexity or options.
5) Relocation allowance will be a couple hundred USD at lower tier ISs, upper tier ISs will provide about $1K USD and open too a shopping allowance. €100 or so isnt unusual for a landing allowance.
6) You need to ask for PD, otherwise you arent likely to get anything except IT training and orientation. €500 is typical, but you can push for €1K. Specify that this is at your discretion with leadership approval.
7) If the IS has a tech program, specifically ask if they provide a laptop/tablet.

Turkish leadership likes to pride itself on being shrewd and negotiating well, ask for everything and be specific.
reisgio
Posts: 206
Joined: Sat Oct 18, 2014 10:17 am

Re: Istanbul

Post by reisgio »

Senator, now that santa claus has shot up an bar popular with Westerners and westernized Turks, are you still living in la la land and considering Istanbul? Please say no. I had such respect for your perspectives up until recently.
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