Countries to start to work late in career for a pension?

[TeacherGal]

Any recommendations for countries where a teacher in late 40s can start to work and put in 15-20 years to get a pension? I'm thinking central and northern European countries? Any particular ones? Any others in Asia? Would 15 years be enough to then retire someplace hot and inexpensive in Africa, Asia, South America if one had modest needs?

[PsyGuy]

You really have to go to WE/NE, in some you could do it in 10. Japan would let you collect after 10, but the pension would be a pittance (it changed recently from 25 years to 10 years). HK and SG both have long work periods and their COL is very high, though in both you could qualify for subsidized housing, you would still have to put in two decades.

[fine dude]

According to Mercer International, these pension systems have guaranteed returns and greater integrity:
Australia, Denmark, Switzerland, The Netherlands
http://www.consultancy.uk/news/2932/cou ... -the-world

[TeacherGal]

I've taught in several schools in Asia, Europe, Africa over the years, from 1-6 years. I've paid the local taxes and I know that some included state pension schemes. I'm thinking that I may be entitled to something at a certain age from some of those countries. It won't be much but together may add up to help pay bills during old age. There must be many other international school teachers in the same boat having done contracts here and there. Do you have any thoughts on trying to collect something from governments you've paid into in the past?

[PsyGuy]

@TeacherGal

Your rational is in error. I know of no national pension scheme that you would be vested in that would allow you to collect a pension in anything less than 10 years, except in the case of disability and in those cases you would have to, among other criteria be resident, and you would effectively be filling for disability under that regions social insurance, not retirement. Your recourse in those regions is to:

1) Apply to the regional/local government authority to have your pension contributions refunded.

2) Return to one of those regions and resume employment, thus building your retirement until properly vested, and then retiring when eligible.

[TeacherGal]

I wonder what kind of job security there are at those international schools in The Netherlands and Switzerland. Is there compulsory retirement at a certain age? Can you easily move into the state run schools if the international school don't work out?

[PsyGuy]

@TeacherGal

Very high job security, an IT can expect to retire out of those regions assuming they dont do something horrible. They have very strong unions and/or labor regulations, in many you would get tenure.

After about 5 years of continuous residence (varies by region) or after meeting other conditions you would be eligible for permanent residence, and you could work anywhere in the region you wanted. If eligible for an EU passport you would have a right to work or reside in any of those regions. The primary issue of working in the local DE system would be the language barrier. The secondary issue would be the lack of an OSH package.

[fine dude]

The only drawback is terror threat in these countries although Switzerland is relatively safer than its neighbors and we are not sure for how long we can say so.

[PsyGuy]

@fine dude

Thats a disadvantage EVERYWHERE, thats how terror works, they dont have to attack everywhere as long as everyone thinks and acts and lives in fear that their location may be next. No one knows who could be next, they may stay in EU, they may move to Asia, there isnt anywhere thats safe if terrorism is a factor, because its a global factor that you cant control for or mitigate.

[senator]

The Malaysian Retirement program - EPF - is a pretty good way to catch up. Schools are required to put in a percentage, some 15 - 17%, and you put in 10 - 13%, depending on the school. A good chunk of change in addition to the other money you save.

If youdon't waste money, in 10 years of working in Malaysia, you could have 200 K USD in your pocket.

[joe30]

I think the best thing to do is start your own pension scheme. Put aside some money from your paycheck each month - that's your pension.

As for where's the best country to make this pension...add up the total value of all the benefits+ salary you get, take off expenses, and that's the total amount you're saving.

A school that contributes 15% to retirement in Malaysia but pays $30k a year is substantially worse than a school paying $45k but contributing nothing to your retirement. The second one just requires YOU to have financial discipline.

In this sense, likely the best countries to work in to build a pension are those in the ME, or the elite schools in Asia.

[PsyGuy]

@senator

Thats not much of a retirement ($200K), and in 10 years you could be vested in a lifetime social pension scheme.
You could go to the ME and with much higher savings potential save that independently yourself in much less time.

@joe30

Thats not a pension, thats savings. The LW is looking for a location with the shortest ACTUAL pension and retirement program.

[TeacherGal]

I'm thinking the best place, regardless of what I can personally save there, is the place that gives me a pension after 15-20 years that gives me enough money for however long I live, to have an okay standard of living in an inexpensive country. Retiring in Europe, North America, Australia, etc. would probably be a dream at this point.

[PsyGuy]

@TeacherGal

Well there are EU regions that will vest you in a pension scheme after 10 years. If you need short, the US may be your best opportunity, there are states that will vest you at 5 years. You still have to wait until retirement age to collect.

[joe30]

I guess I just don't see the difference between a 'pension' and 'savings'. The pension you're getting will have a cash value (i.e. if the employer contributes 15% of salary), and if we're talking about paying tax into a state pension scheme, then work out how much you can get after 'x' number of years, add on how much you could save in addition, then factor in your opportunity cost of working there rather than in another place.

For instance, if you work in the UK, you can pay National Insurance, and each year you do this entitles you to 1/30th of the full state pension (around £600 a month). So we can say each year you work in the UK, you get £240 a year in pension funds upon retirement. Now go to a pension calculator and work out how much you need to save to get £240 a month if you weren't investing in the state pension. That figure is the value of your pension scheme per year. If you qualify for a teachers pension (not sure if the independent sector does or not) then add this value to your scheme, etc.

I can tell you now it's rarely going to be worth working in Western Europe specifically to get a pension. The high cost of living, the high taxes, and not getting accomodation provided will obliterate any value you get from a pension scheme. Of course you may have other reasons for wanting to work there and that's fine.