Job Prospects: June 2016 Certification

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Hanitizer
Posts: 1
Joined: Thu Apr 14, 2016 12:42 pm

Job Prospects: June 2016 Certification

Post by Hanitizer »

I'm hoping someone can give me advice on international teaching without two years of experience.

A bit of background: I'm graduating in May with a M.A. in TESOL (with certification) from a U.S. school--I'll also be certified in Sp. Ed. as a result of the Praxis. My state lets you test into other areas. I won't actually receive my certification until June. I taught for 2 years in hagwons in Korea, so I have some experience overseas but no countable teaching experience. I also substitute taught 2 years--again not countable as experience but it might give me a leg up on newly certified candidates who have no real classroom experience.

So people here seem to agree the best course would be to teach two years (probably Sp. Ed.) in the U.S. and then apply to international schools. But I'm interested in going abroad immediately, and I was hoping people might have some advice on where to apply and what the downsides of such an approach would be.

Question 1) It looks like there's one posting in ESL in Africa that requires no experience on TIE right now. Do I have a shot at postings like that with no experience? I'm sure my references are good (student supervisor and mentor teachers). Is it worth even applying before I have my certification? I probably won't receive it until mid to late June. Is that too late to have a chance of finding a job?

Question 2) If I managed to get a job in Africa or the ME or some other hardship posting, would it negatively affect my career going forward? I don't have any real desire to teach in one of the best international schools in the world, but I don't want to be stuck at only low tier 3 schools either. I am also interested in teaching in Africa, so I don't see an initial placement there as a negative.

Question 3) Is an internship out of the question for ESL or Sp. Ed.?

Thanks for any advice! I've already gotten a lot of good information from this site.
sciteach
Posts: 258
Joined: Sat Dec 13, 2014 7:49 am

Re: Job Prospects: June 2016 Certification

Post by sciteach »

Hi there,

Just remember what I write below is my opinion so please take it as a grain of salt.

For newly graduated teachers - the most important thing when they start their careers is to find a school that will support them and allow them to grow to become the teacher you will eventually become. We all come into teaching idealistic thinking we are good teachers who will make an immediate difference straight out of college. Most almost all of us - this is a fallacy. The first couple of years is when you learn how to actually teach and being thrown into the lions den of a bad school in a difficult country to live in with possibly crooked admin is about the worse way to start any teaching career - especially one such as SE.

So to answer your questions

1) You always have a shot - but there is probably a reason why a school is advertising on an almost free to advertise site which has no screening when it comes to the quality of the school

2) Not really - it can help with some schools. It shows that you can hack difficult situations and won't do a runner as soon as possible.

3) Not sure - but normally you will be the only SE person in a school
wrldtrvlr123
Posts: 1173
Joined: Sat Feb 06, 2010 10:59 am
Location: Japan

Re: Job Prospects: June 2016 Certification

Post by wrldtrvlr123 »

Hanitizer wrote:
> I'm hoping someone can give me advice on international teaching without two
> years of experience.
>
> A bit of background: I'm graduating in May with a M.A. in TESOL (with
> certification) from a U.S. school--I'll also be certified in Sp. Ed. as a
> result of the Praxis. My state lets you test into other areas. I won't
> actually receive my certification until June. I taught for 2 years in
> hagwons in Korea, so I have some experience overseas but no countable
> teaching experience. I also substitute taught 2 years--again not countable
> as experience but it might give me a leg up on newly certified candidates
> who have no real classroom experience.
>
> So people here seem to agree the best course would be to teach two years
> (probably Sp. Ed.) in the U.S. and then apply to international schools. But
> I'm interested in going abroad immediately, and I was hoping people might
> have some advice on where to apply and what the downsides of such an
> approach would be.
>
> Question 1) It looks like there's one posting in ESL in Africa that
> requires no experience on TIE right now. Do I have a shot at postings like
> that with no experience? I'm sure my references are good (student
> supervisor and mentor teachers). Is it worth even applying before I have my
> certification? I probably won't receive it until mid to late June. Is that
> too late to have a chance of finding a job?
>
> Question 2) If I managed to get a job in Africa or the ME or some other
> hardship posting, would it negatively affect my career going forward? I
> don't have any real desire to teach in one of the best international
> schools in the world, but I don't want to be stuck at only low tier 3
> schools either. I am also interested in teaching in Africa, so I don't see
> an initial placement there as a negative.
>
> Question 3) Is an internship out of the question for ESL or Sp. Ed.?
>
> Thanks for any advice! I've already gotten a lot of good information from
> this site.
-----------------------------------

1- Of course you have a shot at almost any job. The odds will generally decrease along with the quality of the teaching environment and/or desirability of the location. Many schools will be hiring over the summer and even into the fall due to last minute resignations, people backing out of agreements, new openings and difficulties recruiting for a host of reasons.

2- Working in a less than desirable location will not hurt your CV at all. Sometimes working in schools with really poor reputations could affect you negatively (if you are working in a 3rd tier school and applying for an elite school you will be facing long odds) but you don't really need to worry about that for the foreseeable future as you will be paying your dues and getting yourself established.

3. Internships are possible in ESL and SPED at some of the better/larger schools who would have the staff to support, guide and train the interns. These are relatively few in number but certainly worth looking into as it gets you some experience in a good working environment and allows to establish some connections which could be very useful in taking your next step.

In short, as has been posted, the drawbacks to striking out now are that you will generally be limited to lower quality schools/less desirable locations. Many countries will also restrict visas to teachers with a degree and two years of experience. The other drawback that sciteach mentioned is also worth considering (teacher development). Many people will develop and better hones their skills in a structured and supportive working environment, which is not generally going to be a lower tier int'l school in a developing nation. Other people thrive in more dynamic and challenging environments. Only you know which is more likely to apply to you.

If you have the itch and just can't see yourself staying home for two more years and you go into things with eyes open, then by all means apply for anything and everything that you see. If you are open to countries that many would consider challenging or a last resort then you should be able to find something decent or at least survivable. Just make sure that it is an actual K-12 school that at least pretends to be an int'l school and is ideally accredited by someone, somewhere. Then start paying your dues and attempting to hone your craft. Good luck!
PsyGuy
Posts: 10789
Joined: Wed Oct 12, 2011 9:51 am
Location: Northern Europe

Response

Post by PsyGuy »

I do not in general disagree with the prior contributors, in this specific case I would recommend pursuing IE.

The primary issue as has been identified is that ISs are not generally resourced to mentor a NQT. The preparation you have in your EPP/ITT program is very "idealistic", an IS will reflect that ideal to varying degrees. The issues with remaining in DE for 2 years are as follows.

1) In general an IS (as a private/independent institution) is going to have less behavioral/classroom management issues. Outside of the west ITs/DTs get a lot more respect. Students take their studies seriously, and their parents are highly invested, your not going to be walking into a classroom of chaos.

2) Theres less need to be organized, as above you dont need to win over your students, your the IT the assumption is you know what your doing (even if you dont) you have less of a mandate to prove yourself (to the students) from day one.

3) Thers is going to be less of an emphasis on external assessments, the weeks (months) youd spend in a DS preparing students in special populations to pass whatever the high stakes assessment is wont be there. Which is essentially spending two years (or however many you have) fighting a losing battle.

4) In IE SPED/SEN/LS/LD is very mild, your going to have mostly high functioning students that require learning support. Even the elite tier ISs are pretty mild in their spectrum of what they will admit. If you stay in DE you could get anything, you could get placed in a BMU or life skills, and as you entered SEN by examination you have no more SEN training or experience than any other DT. Thats sink or swim in a pool of sharks, maybe you move faster, more likely you just die sooner.

5) ESOL is a different issue. In a DS your going to find mostly students of immigrants with varying degrees of motivation. Most of them are going to be pretty low, their in your class because they have to be there, and most of them (who will be Spanish speakers not Korean) arent going to care too much about learning the language because from their perspective they dont need it. You will also have the same testing issues you are going to have with SEN students. You very likely are not going to make the progress the local authority is going to expect.

6) Paperwork, in an IS documentation requirements are obscenely low. In ESOL they are no different than any other departmental IT, and for SEN they arent much more. A weekly log with a brief blurb on progress, and an end of term summative. An action plan (IEP) is a much easier process. You will likely be the only SEN IT in a small IS. You and the school counselor are the entirety of the SEN team/department. Youll put together a brief one page (maybe 2) plan, and an administrator will approve it and present it to the parents. The file of an SEN student in an IS is vastly thinner than one you will likely find in a DS. Many ITT/EPP programs do not present the realistic requirments of documentation int heir programs. Its not uncommon to spend as much time on documentation as you do instruction.

7) The quality of mentors and developmental support varies drastically. It would be far easier to endorse if you could ensure that your DS mentor and administration were there to support you, and actually guide you, but thats not a guarantee and could be closer to fantasy. Mentor even in DSs dont co-teach with you, and depending who it is, you might get 10 minutes a day before the final bell to ask for guidance, you might get more, you might get none. The mentor assigned to you could be little more than a DT on burnout just waiting for retirement, and all they do is push you into the water. If your on a resource team in SEN you might be working side by side with another DT but then you may end up working more as an aid than a DT. Most mentor teachers dont get compensated, or they get compensated very little, maybe a small stipend of a few hundred coin for the year, maybe a comp day.
An IS isnt going to be much different, at a good IS you get a mentor IT who you can talk about stuff with for your first year/term, but there help is more about how to survive in your new country. The expectation is that you know how to manage and conduct lessons and your classroom. In IE you might not have a mentor IT at all.
Its hard enough for a general classroom DT, where you can open a textbook and start on page one and work your way through it until you have more but in special populations there isnt often a textbook, and if there is its so above their ZPD you literally need to go down a significant number of GEs, year 10 students who need a year 3 text. You dont get those students in IE. SEN or ESOL in IE is a little more exposure and a little more individual attention with students that are at or just below grade level. Thats much easier for a NQT to work with, especially one who took a test to get into that classroom.

8) ISs are generally not resourced for NQTs who need guidance. Parents are paying tuition and fees and they expect a quality education, not be a high priced proving ground with their children as lab rats. Administration is not likely in an IS to give you any more support or resources than any other IT.
The problem is a DS may be no better, you could end up in a DS with a leadership team that is deaf and blind to special population needs becuase they know they will never meet the local authorities expectations and their time is better spent filling out the documentation of what they need to do to improve than helping the new NQT. You could end up with leadership in both IE and DE who will think nothing of using your job/dismissal as a boot against your throat to perform.
If i had to pick the arena to do that battle with id much rather be in IE where Im more likely to have students who I can make some demonstrable progress with, who are near the ZPD for their GE and whos parents are likely to have the resources to contribute to their childs improvement. In a DS in SEN its not how well you do, but how poorly you fail the lowest student, because thats the student your going to be meeting with the HOD of SEN, the coordinator of special services, the campus leadership, the district special services director, the HOS/superintendent/commissioner, the parents and maybe even lawyers, and then a judge. That doesnt happen in IE.

There are some advantages for starting in DE:

1) Your going to make mistakes, and likely a lot of them and if you have a HOS who understands that it wont effect your reference as much. Your a great DT if you dont run screaming from the campus.

2) You will actually learn a lot in those 2-3 year(especially if your first term you get a class of moderate needs SEN students that are also ESOL, you will learn a LOT in that class, mostly attributes that start with 'P' like persistence, patience, and even wiping up P). You will actually learn to put together a lesson plan thats readable to you instead of a multipage script meant for a professor. You will learn how to externally incentavise students who dont care about grades, referrals or phone calls to parents. Youll build your performance repertoire so that you can engage students who are only momentarily distracted from their phone. You will learn to control your bladder, and will probably either loose weight your first year or will gain about 5 Kg.

3) You will make about 2-3 times more coin in DE than you will in a third tier IS in IE.

4) You will likely complete all your PD renewal requirements in the first 2 years in a DE as a SEN/ESOL DT.

QUESTIONS:

Yes you have a shot and a good one at posting such as you described, this will be a hardship posting. The cost of application is extremely low, a few minutes to email an application packet, an hour tops for an interview.
Yes, its worth applying before your certification is actually issued, just dont expect too much attention to your application if your not certified. Their are ISs that hire anyone with a pulse.

There is hiring in the summer mostly last minute vacancies and ISs that have a difficult time recruiting year round. The rule is there is a job for anyone if you will accept anything.

It depends on the IS and the reference. A positive reference cant hurt (though from some ISs it doesnt help much). There are ISs that arent respected very well so negative and positive references dont mean very much.

An Internship in SEN or ESOL isnt likely. You see two type of internships in IE, those offered by quality ISs that are really internships and may lead to a permanent offer. The other types you see are lower tier ISs that want inexpensive labor. I could see some of the elite tier ISs with sizable SEN departments hiring an SEN intern. In ESOL lower tier ISs are just as likely to find a LH as opposed to an intern program.

COMMENTS

As to @sciteach:

I dont disagree with the caution of a hardship IS advertising their vacancy on TIE as a indicator of the ISs quality, not likely to be an appointment where you grow much as a professional.

Yes you always have a shot, this is the fallacy the lottery works on as well.

I also agree that if you can make it through a hardship post for two years as an NQT that would show some character and fortitude. The utility of that when recruiting is highly variable, and not likely to mean very much. Leadership has the assumption (right or wrong) that when they hire you, you will fulfill your contract.

You can look at the IS in advance or ask about the composition of its SEN team/department. If its only you, than your not an intern your an IT with a low or LH compensation package.

As to @WT123:

Understand that the peak of recruiting is in January, and fall through out the winter, spring, and summer. Yes there will be vacancies but there wont be many and a larger concentration of them will be in hardship locations.

Again working in a third tier IS could hurt you. Generally the rule is you can move up one tier or move over to a more desirable location at the same tier. Starting in the bottom of tier 3 makes you less marketable and attractive than starting higher on the tier continuum. It could add a couple years to your IT pathway.

I agree that an internship in SPED/ESOL would be difficult to achieve, especially in SEN where you have no background or preparation in it at an upper tier IS.

One of the benefits of a lower tier IS is that the expectations are lower and the time/resource commitment is less. You could probably be in a third tier IS and just let the student explain what they know and their work to you in resource without actually planing anything, except encouraging the student. In inclusion you could probably get by with just explaining and clarifying again without having to do much. At the end of the week you write a sentence or two ont heir progress, and call it a day. No real lesson planing, assessment, or delivery. Collect your coin and enjoy your time.
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