What do you think of this candidate?

PsyGuy
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Response

Post by PsyGuy »

2 years in a 2 year contract isnt a red flag, as long as you have some form of rational for the move (more money, location, city, etc..). As the previous contributors have indicated the lack of any school leaving experience (DIP, AP, A levels) is going to be seen as a deficiency, you dont have exam results to show you are successful in your field. You need to stay longer if your in lower secondary to be able to get access to those school leaving courses. ITs are either hired for those courses or they have to work their way into them, and the tendency is to either hire proven ITs for those courses or have an IT work their way into it.

The other issue is that social studies/humanities/economics is not in high demand. When youve got 100 applications its not about selecting the right person, its first screening out all the applicants you can, since most ITs really are very indistinguishable from one another, something trivial can have an applicant deselected.

The more than 2 years experience is a myth perpetuated by admins who want to reduce turnover, because they have high turnover. You are either at a career IS, where ITs retire out of, or your working your way their. An extra year isnt going to do anything if nothing changes for you that third year (such as leadership, DIP/AP/A levels). if you get a strong reference after two years and nothing else than a third or fourth year does nothing for your resume.
Nomad68
Posts: 175
Joined: Mon Jun 18, 2012 11:50 pm
Location: East of nowhere you want to be

Re: What do you think of this candidate?

Post by Nomad68 »

I appreciate the replies given although I am not the OP!
In my case I am a LMS with IB experience.
The schools I have worked in have been (in order): low Tier 2 (4 years), Tier 3 (1 year), Tier 1 (2 years), upper Tier 2 (current).
My job area can be hard to find - and I am told hard to recruit for in some regions.
I think my resume and experience are strong but as I have a trailing family I appreciate each job search becomes harder.
I am looking at one more 3-5 year position for the savings and then a more longer-term location with a view to putting down roots.
I am approaching the end of year 1 in my current position but by summer 2018 the push factor is my own children's education.
My concern is 2018 may be a year with no or limited vacancies in my field (it does happen) and if a position appears in 2017 should I try for it. (I should mention my current school only offers 1 year contracts).
PsyGuy
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Joined: Wed Oct 12, 2011 9:51 am
Location: Northern Europe

Comment

Post by PsyGuy »

@Nomad68

There is little risk or cost in trying.
Cafare52
Posts: 29
Joined: Sat Nov 29, 2014 5:21 pm

Re: What do you think of this candidate?

Post by Cafare52 »

I am happy to see activity on this post. I thought it had died out for sure.

The good news is my school has committed to having me teach AP-level economics next year and I will be going to the US to train for it this summer.

I will also be able to put "(famous university) adjunct Professor of Economics" on my resume as of August this year after that training, which I would think may entice administrators come hiring time.

But a problem remains:

I really like my school and package. It's a good balance and I enjoy my colleagues who have a lot of experience from which i can learn and the best intentions. Nevertheless, I find it hard to warm-up to the location, which is strange because many people would be thrilled by this place. It offers great quality of life, savings potential, safe living environs, and ample travel opportunities.

All that being said I cannot seem to get on that wavelength and commit to this place for various reasons outside the school which will not change.

So I can either:

Work here for two years, one of which will be teaching AP-level Econ and go to the fair in Bangkok to see what happens with one year teaching AP Econ, 2 years at an IB school teaching non-IB, and 2 years in the states. 6 years total experience, good interviewer, knowledgeable, genial, logical reasoning for leaving each job. IB training but no teaching experience.


or

Stay on an additional year making it 2 years teaching AP-Econ and go to the fair in Bangkok to see what happens with 2 years teaching AP Econ, 2 years at an IB school teaching non-IB, and 2 years in the states. 7 years total experience, good interviewer, knowledgeable, genial, logical reasoning for leaving each job. IB training but no teaching experience.

Any thoughts on this quandary? I know the job market in Social Studies is always stacked against applicants but in my two attempts at international teaching I have been able to find, what I believe to be satisfactory jobs at mediocre schools (one with an outstanding package/ the other with IB) without even having to go to a fair.

I appreciate any feedback I may receive on this extra long post.

Thanks.
PsyGuy
Posts: 10789
Joined: Wed Oct 12, 2011 9:51 am
Location: Northern Europe

Reply

Post by PsyGuy »

@Cafare52

Training at a University doesnt indicate you were appointed to a faculty position at that university, and if you were, unless you were tenure track or term appointed to the rank of professor your title would likely be Lecturer.

If you do get an invite to BKK your not going to be one of the strongest marketable candidates. Depends how you spin it. You could just as easily spin the non-IB experience as IB experience.

The difference between 1 and 2 years of AP experience is negligible.

There really is no dilemma, if you get an invite go to the fair with your one year of AP and see what your offered. If nothing that would motivate you to leave stay another year, if your offered an appointment you like better than where you are take it.
wrldtrvlr123
Posts: 1173
Joined: Sat Feb 06, 2010 10:59 am
Location: Japan

Re: What do you think of this candidate?

Post by wrldtrvlr123 »

PsyGuy wrote:
> 2 years in a 2 year contract isnt a red flag, as long as you have some form of rational
> for the move (more money, location, city, etc..). As the previous contributors have
> indicated the lack of any school leaving experience (DIP, AP, A levels) is going
> to be seen as a deficiency, you dont have exam results to show you are successful
> in your field. You need to stay longer if your in lower secondary to be able to
> get access to those school leaving courses. ITs are either hired for those courses
> or they have to work their way into them, and the tendency is to either hire proven
> ITs for those courses or have an IT work their way into it.
>
> The other issue is that social studies/humanities/economics is not in high demand.
> When youve got 100 applications its not about selecting the right person, its first
> screening out all the applicants you can, since most ITs really are very indistinguishable
> from one another, something trivial can have an applicant deselected.
>
> The more than 2 years experience is a myth perpetuated by admins who want to reduce
> turnover, because they have high turnover. You are either at a career IS, where
> ITs retire out of, or your working your way their. An extra year isnt going to do
> anything if nothing changes for you that third year (such as leadership, DIP/AP/A
> levels). if you get a strong reference after two years and nothing else than a third
> or fourth year does nothing for your resume.
----------------------------------------------------------
Well, no offense but you would say that wouldn't you? Mind you, I am in the same boat as you with DoDDS being the longest gig I have had at any one place.

Make no mistake, too many two contracts is a red flag for many admin types. Is it a deal breaker? No. But it certainly does not help your application and may hurt you with some admin types, especially if you are being compared to someone with more stability.
PsyGuy
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Location: Northern Europe

Reply

Post by PsyGuy »

@WT123

We disagree, as long as you complete your contract with good references 1 year, 2 years, 3 years, etc. does not effect an ITs marketability.
Walter
Posts: 325
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Contact:

Re: What do you think of this candidate?

Post by Walter »

Dave, I think you may be saying this to make yourself feel a little better about your chances next time. The terms "teacher tourist" or "hopper" are used precisely to describe the people who stay in a school for one or two years and have a track record of moving on. Doing it once is fine. Maybe twice is ok. You push your luck if you become known as a serial job shifter.
PsyGuy
Posts: 10789
Joined: Wed Oct 12, 2011 9:51 am
Location: Northern Europe

Reply

Post by PsyGuy »

@Walter

That isnt what a tourist IT is. A tourist IT isnt an IT that completes their contract and leaves. A tourist IT is there for the trip and the travel. They leave as soon as they can in the day, they do the minimum in lessons and planning. They dont really care about the job, the students or the IS, they are there for an extended holiday and using the school to fund their travels. They dont care about the reference because IE is temporary for them.

More smoke and mirrors, If you complete your contract and obtain a good reference it doesnt matter if that time contract is 1, 2, or 3 years, etc..
wrldtrvlr123
Posts: 1173
Joined: Sat Feb 06, 2010 10:59 am
Location: Japan

Re: Reply

Post by wrldtrvlr123 »

PsyGuy wrote:
> @WT123
>
> We disagree, as long as you complete your contract with good references 1
> year, 2 years, 3 years, etc. does not effect an ITs marketability.
------------------
I would expect nothing less from you. People who have been in int'l teaching for any length of time know/will know the reality and can see/decide for themselves how important it is to stick around once in a while. I think even you know it on some level.
PsyGuy
Posts: 10789
Joined: Wed Oct 12, 2011 9:51 am
Location: Northern Europe

Reply

Post by PsyGuy »

@WT123

I think your buying into the myth, good ISs dont need to motivate ITs to stay for longer periods of time, they want to stay. Those ISs that are 2 and done revolving door ISs want to reduce attrition and need to perpetuate this myth that you have to stay and suffer longer than your contract or else you will lose marketability is fear mongering. As long as you have a good reference and complete your contract it doesnt matter how long you stay.
Cafare52
Posts: 29
Joined: Sat Nov 29, 2014 5:21 pm

Re: What do you think of this candidate?

Post by Cafare52 »

Thanks again for the feedback.

It's really a sad situation. I like the school. I love my students. I like my colleagues and I even like my bosses. The City provides ample opportunities for socializing and saving. Everything is working out aside from my placements and the amount of resources we have at the school-almost nothing and it doesn't appear to be getting any better.

After working here for a year it seems more and more like a place where all we care about is filling seats and both students and teachers suffer as a result. The admin. is stuck between a rock and a hard place too because they are well-meaning professionals but our budget is a joke. Most of it goes into our salary while neglecting the conditions of the school, no textbooks, cutting our PD allowance, a cafeteria that doubles as a gymnasium.

I am also not being given the classes I was hired to teach and next year it appears that many of us are going to be stiffed teaching four new preps including AP for the 1st time. Basically I feel like I was mislead out of the gate.

I am still hopeful that the ship will somehow right itself but if not I'm stuck in the unenviable position of having to tell my bosses I am leaving for the reasons above and "Oh yeah, I also need a strong letter of recommendation for Bangkok." I don't doubt I will get a job either but at this point I am really hooping to have a shot at the bigs. So much of this is a crap shoot.

How we end up where we end up...

You have schools like ASJ in Tokyo that has an AP who only taught for one year and looks like she's about 30 years old? How does that happen? Then you have guys like my neighbor at my previous school toiling away for 8 years teaching the same classes unable to break into admin.

Any thoughts on my thoughts?

Summer is right around the corner!
Dredge
Posts: 123
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Location: Three continents, mentally and physically

Re: What do you think of this candidate?

Post by Dredge »

Maybe you need to look at the non-classroom portion of your resume. Have you been involved in any form of school extra-curricular activities in your career, pioneered a new programme at a school, took initiative in curriculum development role?. Or, what was your career before teaching? Did you show drive and upward mobility by taking on management roles? Do you have a Masters Degree (maybe you already said that)?

The 30 year old teacher with one year experience may have all of these things and admins want THESE type of people in their schools so she would get whatever position she wants...probably because they see on paper and through references that she will succeed no matter what.
PsyGuy
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Location: Northern Europe

Reply

Post by PsyGuy »

@Cafare52

When inquiries about fairs and hiring are posed to the forum, one of my strongest pieces of advice is to be "very likable", leadership and IE refers to this as fit, but much of success in IE is a "liking" game. So many factors can go into being likable that arent easily quantifiable. If some particularly young and attractive IT is working some personal relationship and quid pro quo, or the IT is the protege of someone with influence and authority, it doesnt matter whats on your resume, if they can pull the strings and they want to pull the strings they can make it happen.
There are deals like that made all the time though, Ive heard many a primary IT complain they lost an offer or appointment to a less qualified and experienced spouse of an IT the IS really wanted. The local DTs who work just as hard and long as the ITs but because they are local they dont get allowances and their comp is much lower than the OSH "western" ITs.
wrldtrvlr123
Posts: 1173
Joined: Sat Feb 06, 2010 10:59 am
Location: Japan

Re: What do you think of this candidate?

Post by wrldtrvlr123 »

Dredge wrote:
> The 30 year old teacher with one year experience may have all of these
> things and admins want THESE type of people in their schools so she would
> get whatever position she wants...probably because they see on paper and
> through references that she will succeed no matter what.
-------------------------
Wow. That must have been one hell of a year. When did she have time to actually um... teach?

I'm not sure it is accurate that that school in Tokyo has an AP with only one year of teaching experience. If they (or anyone) did it is much more likely that they know someone, are related to someone or someone just likes them (although they also could be a embryonic Rockstar Teacher to boot).
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