Hi all,
I have recently been offered two positions, one in the Chinese city of Shenyang (Shenyang Pacific International Academy) , the other in with the Glenelg school of Abu Dhabi in Madinat Zayed. Both of the schools received relatively negative reviews on the paid section of this site but I would say the reviews for China were marginally more favourable.
Anyway, I'm trying to decide and it's proving very difficult. Salary is about 500 euros more a month in Abu Dhabi but it is longer hours, less holidays and the area is supposedly remote (although I can deal with that). The Chinese job is a good package, school have been very approachable and the teachers I have spoken to have been pleasant. Does anyone have any advice?
Shenyang or Abu Dhabi
Response
I always choose location over IS, work is supposed to be well, work, if it was entertainment you would pay them and not the other way around. If the best part of any job is the IS and the region/local is the pits all you will to look forward to everyday is work, and then work becomes your life. Admins will love this but you will be miserable. You want to maximize the "life" part of work/life balance.
Which IS will provide you a better lifestyle ask yourself what you want to do and what you want to accomplish? What quality of life do you want? How would you describe your after work routine and activities? Do you want a social life involving a romantic interest? Is happy hour and hoisting a pint with friends or coworkers something you need? Is the extra 500€ really going to make a difference for you? Are you involved in studies and need the isolation to focus you? Do you prefer ME or Asian food?
Before you can evaluate pros and cons, advantages and disadvantages you need criteria of needs, wants, detractors and deal breakers. Once you have those you can answer the question of which is better for you.
Were it I, it would be Shenyang and it wouldnt even be close for me.
But forget the ISs, there isnt anything of significant difference to compare that matters.
Which IS will provide you a better lifestyle ask yourself what you want to do and what you want to accomplish? What quality of life do you want? How would you describe your after work routine and activities? Do you want a social life involving a romantic interest? Is happy hour and hoisting a pint with friends or coworkers something you need? Is the extra 500€ really going to make a difference for you? Are you involved in studies and need the isolation to focus you? Do you prefer ME or Asian food?
Before you can evaluate pros and cons, advantages and disadvantages you need criteria of needs, wants, detractors and deal breakers. Once you have those you can answer the question of which is better for you.
Were it I, it would be Shenyang and it wouldnt even be close for me.
But forget the ISs, there isnt anything of significant difference to compare that matters.
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staggerlee
- Posts: 5
- Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2015 6:27 am
Re: Shenyang or Abu Dhabi
Thanks for the response mate! I'll have a think about some of those questions.
Best wishes,
Sean.
Best wishes,
Sean.
Re: Shenyang or Abu Dhabi
You ever been in Northern China in winter? I found that the farther north you go in China, the colder it gets - the Chinese people too.
Do Abu Dhabi. No matter what happens, at least you'll be warm.
Do Abu Dhabi. No matter what happens, at least you'll be warm.
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staggerlee
- Posts: 5
- Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2015 6:27 am
Re: Shenyang or Abu Dhabi
No senator, I haven't, although I have read about the cold and sounds harsh indeed.
Re: Shenyang or Abu Dhabi
I've been to, and lived near, both of these cities (although I don't have any firsthand information about either of those schools).
Shenyang is a big city (10 million plus). It is an industrial city, which comes with pollution and a relatively small expat population (although there are some good guys there). In the winter, it will be cold (although it is a dry cold, which isn't so bad). There are pretty consistent Siberian outflow winds. The cost of living will be low. You won't be driving, but will need to rely on public transportation. You are a five-hour train ride from Beijing, Dalian, or Harbin which are cool places to visit. There are a small number of Western restaurants (non-chain) and a few decent bars/clubs. If you're into Hockey, there is an ice rink and a team.
I've only been to Madinat Zayed once, but it is tiny (I'd guess 30,000 people) and right on the border of the empty quarter (the world's biggest sand desert). There will little pollution, but lots of dust, and it will be hot (it will be hotter than 50 degrees on a regular basis in September). There is a shopping mall, and little else to do there - although there is good fun to be had if you buy a jeep and like dune-bashing). There is little public transport, so you will need to buy a car. There is a bar at the Liwa Hotel a short drive away, but it is expensive. The cost of living will be significantly higher. You will be about an hour and a half from Abu Dhabi, and about three hours from Dubai.
Since there are few expats in both locations, I'm assuming the students at both locations will be nationals. You will have significantly less difficulty with classroom management in Shenyang (if you are a brand new teacher).
I think you could have a positive experience at both, but go in with eyes open. If you are not particularly independent you might not enjoy either.
Weigh your goals:
If you want a more authentic cultural experience, go to Shenyang.
If you want to save more money, go to Shenyang.
If you hate winter, go to Madinat Zayed.
If you're single, go to Shenyang.
YMMV.
Shenyang is a big city (10 million plus). It is an industrial city, which comes with pollution and a relatively small expat population (although there are some good guys there). In the winter, it will be cold (although it is a dry cold, which isn't so bad). There are pretty consistent Siberian outflow winds. The cost of living will be low. You won't be driving, but will need to rely on public transportation. You are a five-hour train ride from Beijing, Dalian, or Harbin which are cool places to visit. There are a small number of Western restaurants (non-chain) and a few decent bars/clubs. If you're into Hockey, there is an ice rink and a team.
I've only been to Madinat Zayed once, but it is tiny (I'd guess 30,000 people) and right on the border of the empty quarter (the world's biggest sand desert). There will little pollution, but lots of dust, and it will be hot (it will be hotter than 50 degrees on a regular basis in September). There is a shopping mall, and little else to do there - although there is good fun to be had if you buy a jeep and like dune-bashing). There is little public transport, so you will need to buy a car. There is a bar at the Liwa Hotel a short drive away, but it is expensive. The cost of living will be significantly higher. You will be about an hour and a half from Abu Dhabi, and about three hours from Dubai.
Since there are few expats in both locations, I'm assuming the students at both locations will be nationals. You will have significantly less difficulty with classroom management in Shenyang (if you are a brand new teacher).
I think you could have a positive experience at both, but go in with eyes open. If you are not particularly independent you might not enjoy either.
Weigh your goals:
If you want a more authentic cultural experience, go to Shenyang.
If you want to save more money, go to Shenyang.
If you hate winter, go to Madinat Zayed.
If you're single, go to Shenyang.
YMMV.
Re: Shenyang or Abu Dhabi
It's not just the cold, it's the people. The northern Chinese were some of the unfriendliest people I ever ran across in all of my Asian travels. Southern China was FANTASTIC!
Combined with the weather, the word "Bleak" is the perfect adjective to use to describe the north.
Combined with the weather, the word "Bleak" is the perfect adjective to use to describe the north.
Re: Shenyang or Abu Dhabi
I think Sitka did an amazing write up. One more thing to consider is the cost of travel. If you plan on getting out of your host country on holidays, China is much more expensive. Just getting to Japan or Korea will often cost over $700 USD. Traveling to more desirable locations in China like Yunnan or Tibet can easily cost the same. In contrast, flights out of Dubai or AD are relatively cheaper and you can choose locations in the ME, Europe, Africa, or Asia.
Assuming the OP is a hetro male, I have a question about dating in MZ. Besides a limited expat pool, will there also be tons of Filipinas (like I've seen in Dubai and Abu Dhabi)? If that were the case, I would say that dating in MZ would be better, but probably not amazing. Shenyang will also have a limited pool of expats, and of course Chinese girls. In either location you can do well with expats, since most of the ladies will not want to date Chinese or ME guys. Most guys I know would rather date Filipinas over Chinese.
Assuming the OP is a hetro male, I have a question about dating in MZ. Besides a limited expat pool, will there also be tons of Filipinas (like I've seen in Dubai and Abu Dhabi)? If that were the case, I would say that dating in MZ would be better, but probably not amazing. Shenyang will also have a limited pool of expats, and of course Chinese girls. In either location you can do well with expats, since most of the ladies will not want to date Chinese or ME guys. Most guys I know would rather date Filipinas over Chinese.
Last edited by nikkor on Mon Jul 13, 2015 9:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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staggerlee
- Posts: 5
- Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2015 6:27 am
Re: Shenyang or Abu Dhabi
Thanks a lot, particularly Sitka for his write up.
Unfortunately, the Visa process is such a ballache for China that I think my decision is going to be made for me.
Unfortunately, the Visa process is such a ballache for China that I think my decision is going to be made for me.
Discussion
I agree Sitka did a very informative write up. Some of the issues to the LW is again prioritizing what is important to you and what isnt.
While getting out of China is more expensive there is much more to see and do within China. I further agree with the social romance position.
China does have a much more exhaustive entry process, but it is compensated by the far more involved exit process in the UAE.
While getting out of China is more expensive there is much more to see and do within China. I further agree with the social romance position.
China does have a much more exhaustive entry process, but it is compensated by the far more involved exit process in the UAE.
Re: Shenyang or Abu Dhabi
Once again, I can only speak on my own experience.
The visa process was pretty straightforward in China for me in China - but I think it varies a lot depending on a) the school and b) the particular visa office you're trying to do it through.
The visa process in the UAE was a nightmare, largely because of the difficulty of getting things authenticated while abroad. If you are married/have children, sponsoring them is an even bigger challenge.
The visa process was pretty straightforward in China for me in China - but I think it varies a lot depending on a) the school and b) the particular visa office you're trying to do it through.
The visa process in the UAE was a nightmare, largely because of the difficulty of getting things authenticated while abroad. If you are married/have children, sponsoring them is an even bigger challenge.
Re: Shenyang or Abu Dhabi
I've lived in both countries. I say do China. It's more interesting and great for travel and exploration.