LOL
We're making progress. PG started by denying the existence of loans. Now we're just debating the fine points. But I really don't care what PG thinks. His opinion about loans is irrelevant to the real people out there who might want one.
For anyone interested in getting a loan, they exist. Different rules, different countries, but very much possible and even common in many countries. I've taken loans for various purposes (car, mortgage, debt consolidation) in various countries, including my native country, several countries I've resided in, and one country I neither resided in nor was a citizen of. (Now I sound like a big fat reckless spender, but I'm not, really.)
Banks are connected internationally, and if you flee a country, you don't necessarily escape the debt. You may escape jail, if you flee to a country that doesn't imprison you for bankruptcy, but you can still have your assets seized and wages garnished. Banks give loans to expats because they know that generally, they will collect. There are always defaulters, in any country, but banks wouldn't be in the game if the house didn't always win over time.
And in case you haven't read the news and debate around the World Cup, as apparently PG has not, thinking it's so easy just to leave Qatar without telling anyone... LOL again. It works like this. To get a loan, your sponsor/employer has to give approval to the bank for you to take a loan (since they will be legally responsible for paying it if you abscond and the bank cannot recover the money). You have to agree to have your salary deposited directly into the bank from your employer, and that cannot be changed until the loan is discharged. The lending limit of the loan is based, generously, on your salary certificate, which is a statement of how much you earn, and not, as PG seems to think, anything to do with how long you will be staying in the country. To leave the country temporarily, you have to have an exit visa approved by your employer and the government; your employer knows that you have a loan, and also that they will be the ones paying it back if you disappear, so they won't issue you one if they suspect you're doing a runner. (Yes, you can lie, PG, we know. Ask for a weekend in Dubai to see the rugby, and then just disappear. We know, you approve of lies. Doesn't mean we do.) To leave the country permanently, your employer has to cancel your visa, which cannot be done without a bank clearance letter. If you manage to disappear through some tissue of lies anyway, your employer has great incentive to help the bank find you - if they can't, the employer has to pay, so you better believe they very quickly turn over everything they know about you, starting with the addresses you used in applying for the job, your mother's phone number, your gmail address, your referees' names and numbers, what someone heard you say about landing a job at the Int'l School of LaLaLand, and everything else.
It's a system that neatly ties up the banking system to the residence visa system, and it is quite effective, and not just against people of certain races, though if you want to believe that your color will protect you, good luck with that, I suspect the bank wants their money regardless of what color you are.
Here's a lovely article about an imprisoned Canadian debtor in the UAE. http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/com ... 64368.html
Buying a car
Re: Buying a car
i can only speak to the UAE but car loans are done here all the time, mostly from the banks but there are some shady lenders (imo) as well.
they'd give a loan to anyone from what i've seen.
they'd give a loan to anyone from what i've seen.
Discussion
@sid
So far your rather evidence is limited solely to the ME. However your claim appears accurate ITs can borrow rather easily and early in various parts of the ME.
Youve been unable to to provide any data to suggest that you cant escape the debt. You still "owe" but that isnt the issue, its can they collect, and enforce that collection. I spent a decade escaping my student loans and one of the primary motivations of going into IE was to escape paying student loans and it worked very well.
What western country maintains debtors prison? Neither CAN, AUS, UK, US do. Many other western countries dont enforce debt obligation for countries outside their jurisdiction, except for the ME and India, and yet another reason to avoid the ME.
Yes the employer will legally be liable for the loan one of several reasons they are going to be clear about how long your employment term/contract is for. A financial institution isnt going to extend a loan over 5 years if the borrower is only contracted intending on staying for 2.
You dont have to agree to have your salary deposited into the bank the citation your referenced from NBK, clearly states "no salary transfer is required for Auto loans.".
While "you" disapprove of lying it does not change the viability or the utility of doing so. Just going on a holiday weekend to Thailand. Spend a couple days there and then dont go back. Lots of people and ITs leave the ME for holidays.
Who cares if they turn over everything they know about you. Your going to be teaching in another country so there wont be anyone at your address, and no ones going to answer that phone once you of course have a new number. Email is easy to filter just mark everything as junk/spam. Why would they have your mothers phone number? Your referees and anyone else is going to most assuredly ignore a ME voice on the phone asking or inquiring about anything financial or about loan payments, they call those scams. Smart people just hang up and block the number. If your pulling a runner you dont tell anyone about it, and certainly not that your not going to IS LaLaLand.
Your article tells such a tale of woe, and had the Canadians just left they would not have the problem they do. No, they opened their mouth, resigned their job, etc. If they would have kept their mouth shut, just left for a holiday and not come back no one would have known they were pulling a runner, and they would be fine.
Contrary to admin logic sometimes the right thing to do, is doing the wrong thing.
If you have a citation of a westerner dragged back to the ME from out of country and jailed for absconding on a debt, reference it.
So far your rather evidence is limited solely to the ME. However your claim appears accurate ITs can borrow rather easily and early in various parts of the ME.
Youve been unable to to provide any data to suggest that you cant escape the debt. You still "owe" but that isnt the issue, its can they collect, and enforce that collection. I spent a decade escaping my student loans and one of the primary motivations of going into IE was to escape paying student loans and it worked very well.
What western country maintains debtors prison? Neither CAN, AUS, UK, US do. Many other western countries dont enforce debt obligation for countries outside their jurisdiction, except for the ME and India, and yet another reason to avoid the ME.
Yes the employer will legally be liable for the loan one of several reasons they are going to be clear about how long your employment term/contract is for. A financial institution isnt going to extend a loan over 5 years if the borrower is only contracted intending on staying for 2.
You dont have to agree to have your salary deposited into the bank the citation your referenced from NBK, clearly states "no salary transfer is required for Auto loans.".
While "you" disapprove of lying it does not change the viability or the utility of doing so. Just going on a holiday weekend to Thailand. Spend a couple days there and then dont go back. Lots of people and ITs leave the ME for holidays.
Who cares if they turn over everything they know about you. Your going to be teaching in another country so there wont be anyone at your address, and no ones going to answer that phone once you of course have a new number. Email is easy to filter just mark everything as junk/spam. Why would they have your mothers phone number? Your referees and anyone else is going to most assuredly ignore a ME voice on the phone asking or inquiring about anything financial or about loan payments, they call those scams. Smart people just hang up and block the number. If your pulling a runner you dont tell anyone about it, and certainly not that your not going to IS LaLaLand.
Your article tells such a tale of woe, and had the Canadians just left they would not have the problem they do. No, they opened their mouth, resigned their job, etc. If they would have kept their mouth shut, just left for a holiday and not come back no one would have known they were pulling a runner, and they would be fine.
Contrary to admin logic sometimes the right thing to do, is doing the wrong thing.
If you have a citation of a westerner dragged back to the ME from out of country and jailed for absconding on a debt, reference it.
Re: Buying a car
Here is my personal experience from the UAE:
Getting approved for a car loan was not difficult once you are officially a resident (which is little comfort for those stuck working on a tourist visa for a significant period of time). All it took was a salary certificate from my company, a copy of my passport, visa, and residence ID. The car needed to be evaluated by an official evaluator (mine seemed less than competent).
In the UAE, there is a gratuity paid for each year that you work (21 days salary for the first five years - more after that). That gratuity is held as collateral against your loans - you can't access it until you cancel your residence visa, and you can't cancel your residence visa until your loans are paid off. So if you skip out on your loan, they will at the very least be able to recover your gratuity.
Cheers
Getting approved for a car loan was not difficult once you are officially a resident (which is little comfort for those stuck working on a tourist visa for a significant period of time). All it took was a salary certificate from my company, a copy of my passport, visa, and residence ID. The car needed to be evaluated by an official evaluator (mine seemed less than competent).
In the UAE, there is a gratuity paid for each year that you work (21 days salary for the first five years - more after that). That gratuity is held as collateral against your loans - you can't access it until you cancel your residence visa, and you can't cancel your residence visa until your loans are paid off. So if you skip out on your loan, they will at the very least be able to recover your gratuity.
Cheers
Re: Buying a car
Thanks for all the information. We don't plan on using a loan to finance for a car but there were some things I wasn't aware of so thanks for pointing those out.
Respect.
Respect.