Hello all, and thanks in advance for your help.
I am looking to break into the world of IS teaching. I am recently certified, and do not have any teaching experience outside of 4 years at a Korean private academy (one year as an administrator). I plan to be married to a Korean woman who has a child from a previous marriage. How much of an issue is this going to be for me? In your experience, how many schools out there will still consider me?
I'm not sure how much this matters, but my girlfriend is a world-class professional musician and could probably qualify for an artist visa in many countries. Would it perhaps be better to remain unmarried and apply to schools as a single teacher, then have her deal with her own visa separately?
I'm hoping you guys will help me to get some realistic expectations of the hiring climate I'll encounter, and perhaps also help me see this from any angles I might be ignoring.
Thanks again!
How big of a setback is a trailing spouse and 1 dependent?
-
andybaxley86
- Posts: 20
- Joined: Mon Mar 25, 2013 9:25 am
- Location: Seoul
-
shadowjack
- Posts: 2140
- Joined: Sat Oct 06, 2012 9:49 am
Re: How big of a setback is a trailing spouse and 1 dependen
Just a hint - in some of the countries you might be considered for a position, there isn't a cultural demand for a world class musician.
That said - can she teach music? Run an orchestra or band? If so, and she has a masters or some other document, she could teach music at the school. Especially if she is well known, it could be a marketing tool for the school.
So, it is not a deal-breaker, but it is a factor. Your lack of experience (no real experience whatsoever, despite what you might think of your 4 years) will be the main factor. Looking at it that way, your wife might be the one to get you in the door. Perhaps try applying at one of the Jeju-do schools or Song-do?
That said - can she teach music? Run an orchestra or band? If so, and she has a masters or some other document, she could teach music at the school. Especially if she is well known, it could be a marketing tool for the school.
So, it is not a deal-breaker, but it is a factor. Your lack of experience (no real experience whatsoever, despite what you might think of your 4 years) will be the main factor. Looking at it that way, your wife might be the one to get you in the door. Perhaps try applying at one of the Jeju-do schools or Song-do?
-
andybaxley86
- Posts: 20
- Joined: Mon Mar 25, 2013 9:25 am
- Location: Seoul
Re: How big of a setback is a trailing spouse and 1 dependen
Shadowjack-
She's logged many hundreds of hours teaching music privately to high school and university students, but she's never run an orchestra or band. She does have a masters from Boston U though, so I'm sure that would help. She's not well-known, but she has played with some big names in Korea.
All that said, she has no way of obtaining a license from the US- at least not that I know of. Wouldn't that be a deal breaker? Do you think a school might hire her even though she's not a native English speaker (although she is fluent) and doesn't have a license?
She's logged many hundreds of hours teaching music privately to high school and university students, but she's never run an orchestra or band. She does have a masters from Boston U though, so I'm sure that would help. She's not well-known, but she has played with some big names in Korea.
All that said, she has no way of obtaining a license from the US- at least not that I know of. Wouldn't that be a deal breaker? Do you think a school might hire her even though she's not a native English speaker (although she is fluent) and doesn't have a license?
-
eion_padraig
- Posts: 408
- Joined: Sat Dec 11, 2010 8:18 pm
Re: How big of a setback is a trailing spouse and 1 dependen
Whether a school can hire her will, in part, depend on the laws of the country where the school is located. In some cases, they won't be able to get a work visa for her.
Whether they will hire her, if they are legally able to, will depend on lots of individual factors related to the school. It is doubtful that more established schools would hire a newly certified teacher (you) and your wife as a music teacher. Once you both get some experience, you'll be much more marketable. Not being a native English speaker should not be a deal breaker if she has fluent English, including reading and writing abilities.
If you are planning on leaving Korea, her language ability in Korean may be valuable as lots of international schools have many Korean students and having someone who can communicate with parents of these students could prove very valuable. I know some schools, which have staff who speak Korean serve as contacts between staff and student families.
Again, I'd say lack of experience is a bigger factor that one or two dependents. You didn't mention what you teach. If you are in a high need area, that could make things easier for you.
Whether they will hire her, if they are legally able to, will depend on lots of individual factors related to the school. It is doubtful that more established schools would hire a newly certified teacher (you) and your wife as a music teacher. Once you both get some experience, you'll be much more marketable. Not being a native English speaker should not be a deal breaker if she has fluent English, including reading and writing abilities.
If you are planning on leaving Korea, her language ability in Korean may be valuable as lots of international schools have many Korean students and having someone who can communicate with parents of these students could prove very valuable. I know some schools, which have staff who speak Korean serve as contacts between staff and student families.
Again, I'd say lack of experience is a bigger factor that one or two dependents. You didn't mention what you teach. If you are in a high need area, that could make things easier for you.
-
andybaxley86
- Posts: 20
- Joined: Mon Mar 25, 2013 9:25 am
- Location: Seoul
Re: How big of a setback is a trailing spouse and 1 dependen
Thank you for the insight ion.
Unfortunately, my certifications (ESOL K-12 and K-6 gen. ed.) are not in high need areas. That said, I may work on adding a high need endorsement in order to make myself a bit more marketable.
Unfortunately, my certifications (ESOL K-12 and K-6 gen. ed.) are not in high need areas. That said, I may work on adding a high need endorsement in order to make myself a bit more marketable.
Response
The rule is "there is a job for everyone if you will accept anything". Its not good though, its pretty bad. Looking at your marketability, you have some major issues:
1) You have no credible experience in education. The typical bar to IT entry is 2 years of post certification, K-12 classroom, (or appropriate setting) experience. Nothing you have done in SK will count or matter. This makes you an intern IT. Its not hopeless, there are ISs that will take anyone with a pulse they can legally get into the classroom. Those ISs are not likely to be positive experiences, ISs are not really resourced or have programs to provide an intern the appropriate mentoring and supervision to develop into a professional IT. At the minimum this would require an admin/management to assign a teacher to mentor you, and the IS isnt likely to be compensating the teacher for that.
The other issue is that ISs are private/independent tuition and fee collecting ISs, the parents arent paying thousands of coin for their children to be an intern teachers "learning" experience. Their expectation is that their childrens ITs know what they are doing.
2) Your certification area/subject isnt in high demand, just about everyone has an elementary/primary certification. Domestically being a male primary teacher is a bonus, but in IE the preference is still for the maternal female primary teacher, especially in lower primary.
3) Your partner (GF/wife) only enters the equation if you were a professionally and experienced IT with high needs qualifications and proven exam performance, then an appointment for your partner becomes realistic (more below).
4) In your title you expressed a spouse and a dependent which I assume is a child, thats an intern teacher with a trailing spouse and a dependent. An IS has to travel 3 people to put an intern in a classroom. That makes for a very expensive hire, for little value.
Your partner is South Korean, regardless of her fluency, she isnt a native English speaker, and for many schools "looking the part" of a westerner is just as important as anything on a resume. Those ISs define a native speaker or western IT as being from the US, CAN, AUS, or UK. If your partner were a foreign language (Korean) IT that would be more marketable.
Unless your partner is Hyuna, then being a world class musician doesnt make her a marketable music teacher (its unlikley anyone on the IE circuit would know of her). I understand shes done many private lessons at upper secondary and tertiary, and has a Masters but thats a far different task then teaching a room full of 8 year olds bells, or teaching a room full of teenagers who arent really interested in music outside of listening to it, or playing guitar hero. If she cant do band and/or choral, she wouldnt be very marketable, as thats what schools need when it comes to K-12 music teachers. In addition she needs to be able to organize and produce a recital and provide the music support/accompaniment for any dramatic productions.
If she has all those skills and can talk about them intelligently than license/certificate or not she has marketability. I would recommend putting together a portfolio of work for her, complete with some video and audio samples (if she has them). You may find a recruiter who recognizes her and is a fan, which could easily secure her an offer. Specialist positions in fine/performing arts and vocational positions are not as restricted by credentials as core teaching fields are, when the specialist either offers something unique to the curriculum, or the school is small enough that they have some flexibility in what constitutes a qualified teacher, though these schools are typically lower tier ISs.
You should get married, assuming you want to get married. Artist visa are usually restricted to less than a year and the typical IS contract is 2 years. The lack of a definitive location limits concluding if your partner would or would not qualify for an artist visa. Some regions have very lax requirements and some very strict. Artist visas are typically of short duration for a conference or performance. Those that are studying or practicing their art typically must apply for a student type of visa.
The other issue is your child, which greatly complicates the issue of a single parent bringing a child into the country without the expressed written approval and permission of the other parent or a court order. Having the other parent entering the country on a non resident type visa may greatly concern immigration officials. You likely dont want that problem.
There is little "upside" in your specific scenario segregating your relationship and family logistics. The only way it works is if you are hired at an IS in the WE, in which case you can declare your relationship after you are hired and the IS would be in a very indefensible position if they attempted to terminate you or did not provide mandatory benefits. It would be even better if you claimed the relationship after receiving tenure.
There are a number of ways she could obtain a US teaching certificate, many of them would be solved if you were married, as then she could obtain a SS number:
1) Teach Ready (FL) and Teach Now (D.C.) would be online overseas certification pathways. Teach Now does not require citizenship to obtain a D.C. teaching license. However the programs do have limitations and restrictions.
2) As an alternative to an EPP/OTT program a number of states will issue a certification if she obtains a doctorate.
3) She could attempt to apply for CT (2 years) certification on the basis of her teaching experience or CA (3 years, and far more stringent).
Another option is to look outside the USA a PGCEi can be obtained through a number of UK universities (Uni. Nottingham being the most popular), which will be accepted at lower tier ISs on its own, but can be used to apply for a full teaching certification in the US though several states (D.C. being the easiest) and then apply for full QTS in the UK. This would give her a lifetime teaching license (QTS) and the OTT (PGCEi) in education.
There is a state/territory in AUS that has a certification option for Music Education Specialists based on an advanced degree in performance music (not musical theory) though I no longer know if the program option is still available.
There is also the potential of applying as a Korean Language teacher in the US, and then adding the music (and other certification areas) once she has a foreign language teaching certificate.
She might also pursue obtaining some form of SK music certification, and then transfer that certificate to a US (such as D.C. or CA) state for a US certification.
Lastly, she could look into an IB Teaching and Learning Certificate, though its not equivalent to a government issued credential, and they can be expensive.
1) You have no credible experience in education. The typical bar to IT entry is 2 years of post certification, K-12 classroom, (or appropriate setting) experience. Nothing you have done in SK will count or matter. This makes you an intern IT. Its not hopeless, there are ISs that will take anyone with a pulse they can legally get into the classroom. Those ISs are not likely to be positive experiences, ISs are not really resourced or have programs to provide an intern the appropriate mentoring and supervision to develop into a professional IT. At the minimum this would require an admin/management to assign a teacher to mentor you, and the IS isnt likely to be compensating the teacher for that.
The other issue is that ISs are private/independent tuition and fee collecting ISs, the parents arent paying thousands of coin for their children to be an intern teachers "learning" experience. Their expectation is that their childrens ITs know what they are doing.
2) Your certification area/subject isnt in high demand, just about everyone has an elementary/primary certification. Domestically being a male primary teacher is a bonus, but in IE the preference is still for the maternal female primary teacher, especially in lower primary.
3) Your partner (GF/wife) only enters the equation if you were a professionally and experienced IT with high needs qualifications and proven exam performance, then an appointment for your partner becomes realistic (more below).
4) In your title you expressed a spouse and a dependent which I assume is a child, thats an intern teacher with a trailing spouse and a dependent. An IS has to travel 3 people to put an intern in a classroom. That makes for a very expensive hire, for little value.
Your partner is South Korean, regardless of her fluency, she isnt a native English speaker, and for many schools "looking the part" of a westerner is just as important as anything on a resume. Those ISs define a native speaker or western IT as being from the US, CAN, AUS, or UK. If your partner were a foreign language (Korean) IT that would be more marketable.
Unless your partner is Hyuna, then being a world class musician doesnt make her a marketable music teacher (its unlikley anyone on the IE circuit would know of her). I understand shes done many private lessons at upper secondary and tertiary, and has a Masters but thats a far different task then teaching a room full of 8 year olds bells, or teaching a room full of teenagers who arent really interested in music outside of listening to it, or playing guitar hero. If she cant do band and/or choral, she wouldnt be very marketable, as thats what schools need when it comes to K-12 music teachers. In addition she needs to be able to organize and produce a recital and provide the music support/accompaniment for any dramatic productions.
If she has all those skills and can talk about them intelligently than license/certificate or not she has marketability. I would recommend putting together a portfolio of work for her, complete with some video and audio samples (if she has them). You may find a recruiter who recognizes her and is a fan, which could easily secure her an offer. Specialist positions in fine/performing arts and vocational positions are not as restricted by credentials as core teaching fields are, when the specialist either offers something unique to the curriculum, or the school is small enough that they have some flexibility in what constitutes a qualified teacher, though these schools are typically lower tier ISs.
You should get married, assuming you want to get married. Artist visa are usually restricted to less than a year and the typical IS contract is 2 years. The lack of a definitive location limits concluding if your partner would or would not qualify for an artist visa. Some regions have very lax requirements and some very strict. Artist visas are typically of short duration for a conference or performance. Those that are studying or practicing their art typically must apply for a student type of visa.
The other issue is your child, which greatly complicates the issue of a single parent bringing a child into the country without the expressed written approval and permission of the other parent or a court order. Having the other parent entering the country on a non resident type visa may greatly concern immigration officials. You likely dont want that problem.
There is little "upside" in your specific scenario segregating your relationship and family logistics. The only way it works is if you are hired at an IS in the WE, in which case you can declare your relationship after you are hired and the IS would be in a very indefensible position if they attempted to terminate you or did not provide mandatory benefits. It would be even better if you claimed the relationship after receiving tenure.
There are a number of ways she could obtain a US teaching certificate, many of them would be solved if you were married, as then she could obtain a SS number:
1) Teach Ready (FL) and Teach Now (D.C.) would be online overseas certification pathways. Teach Now does not require citizenship to obtain a D.C. teaching license. However the programs do have limitations and restrictions.
2) As an alternative to an EPP/OTT program a number of states will issue a certification if she obtains a doctorate.
3) She could attempt to apply for CT (2 years) certification on the basis of her teaching experience or CA (3 years, and far more stringent).
Another option is to look outside the USA a PGCEi can be obtained through a number of UK universities (Uni. Nottingham being the most popular), which will be accepted at lower tier ISs on its own, but can be used to apply for a full teaching certification in the US though several states (D.C. being the easiest) and then apply for full QTS in the UK. This would give her a lifetime teaching license (QTS) and the OTT (PGCEi) in education.
There is a state/territory in AUS that has a certification option for Music Education Specialists based on an advanced degree in performance music (not musical theory) though I no longer know if the program option is still available.
There is also the potential of applying as a Korean Language teacher in the US, and then adding the music (and other certification areas) once she has a foreign language teaching certificate.
She might also pursue obtaining some form of SK music certification, and then transfer that certificate to a US (such as D.C. or CA) state for a US certification.
Lastly, she could look into an IB Teaching and Learning Certificate, though its not equivalent to a government issued credential, and they can be expensive.