ITs with more than 2 kids?

Bellarex
Posts: 101
Joined: Fri Feb 24, 2012 10:39 pm

ITs with more than 2 kids?

Post by Bellarex »

Hey all, it's been a long time since I've been on here...

My wife and I are both teaching internationally have two school-age children. We've always wanted to have three kids, but the more experience we get with the international circuit, the more it seems that couples don't usually have more than two. I know this is because many (most?) schools only make tuition and flight allowances for two, and that it makes traveling during breaks more expensive due to flights, etc.

But I'm wondering if there are schools out there that make provisions for more than two kids. I'm on my way to becoming an administrator as well - are there more provisions for admin than teachers in this regard? Do any of you out there have 3 or more kids that would care to comment on your experience?
Heimtun
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Joined: Wed Jan 07, 2015 9:53 pm

Re: ITs with more than 2 kids?

Post by Heimtun »

The American International School of Dhaka offers full benefits (airline tickets, full school tuition, appropriate housing, etc) for families with three children. We are heading there with our three children in a few short months, and I have been incredibly impressed thus far with the friendliness and the level of support given to new employees; they have really gone above and beyond to ensure a smooth transition.
mamava
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Joined: Sat May 11, 2013 7:56 am

Re: ITs with more than 2 kids?

Post by mamava »

The International School of Beijing and Hong Kong International School allow 3 dependents. We're currently in Saudi which also allows 3 dependents--and a number of colleagues here worked for QSI schools and have 3+ kids. It seems that some schools with big money or schools that have a harder time recruiting may be more likely to allow more than 2, but having 3 children is definitely a compromising factor. At one point we thought we would have to change jobs with 3 children, one approaching his senior year. We were offered 2 jobs where we offered to pay for all costs of out oldest since it would be just for 1 year--flights, insurance, tuition--and were turned down.
PsyGuy
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Location: Northern Europe

Response

Post by PsyGuy »

While there are ISs like QSI that will take a large family, you would be putting yourself out of a career. Kids are career killers. Your already pushing it with 2 (at a 1:1 ratio), a lot of entry ITs would be turned away from premium agencies and would see a lot of lost interest in their resumes. Add a third child and your career is over especially when one of you has to become a trailing spouse for 6 years until the child is school age. 3 kids and a trailing spouse you need to be an admin to make that work. Admins have it easier, OSH relocation factors are just a given, regardless of family size, for admins what gets talked about is the salary and the bonus.
mamava
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Re: ITs with more than 2 kids?

Post by mamava »

I would disagree that kids are career killers. Everywhere I go, everyone I meet, there are lots of kids at international schools that are teachers's kids. I know there are schools that for certain reasons do strongly prefer no kids or singles, but there are PLENTY of jobs for families with children. The 3rd child thing is tricky--we lucked out at a big resourced school that took 3, but definitely we would have had a lot of limitations trying to find a job at a school that would suit us and take 3 kids. We went overseas with 3 children, but if I had 2 children and was already overseas, I would definitely not have had a 3rd.

If you land a spot in SE Asia, you have the opportunity to have house help for child care so you don't have to be a stay home mom. Our current school in Saudi has nurseries on campus so parents can bring their babies in to work.

Again, it's not impossible but with 3 kids it is very challenging.
Overhere
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Joined: Wed Dec 05, 2007 3:29 am

Re: ITs with more than 2 kids?

Post by Overhere »

I would agree, three kids are not a career killer though you will have to put some more thought into your teaching future. We were turned down by ISS flat but attended the fair at Northern Iowa twice and managed to land jobs both times. Accommodation for three kids can be made.
Bellarex
Posts: 101
Joined: Fri Feb 24, 2012 10:39 pm

Re: ITs with more than 2 kids?

Post by Bellarex »

My wife and I both teach, so no trailing spouse. She'd like to take a year off if able, so we'd probably wait to have a third until we were already established in a place that accommodates accordingly. My next spot will hopefully be in an assistant principalship, so maybe that will help the situation.
mamava
Posts: 320
Joined: Sat May 11, 2013 7:56 am

Re: ITs with more than 2 kids?

Post by mamava »

Being admin. would help you in some cases, as schools can be more flexible that way. We were overseas doing development work (experienced teachers but not working specifically as teachers and our first time overseas) in Africa. We were accepted by Search with 3 children. Things may have changed, though, in that respect. From our experience and people I've watched, 3 kids will limit your options.

I should also mention that we know a family with 3 children who were hired at the American School of Doha.
Heimtun
Posts: 25
Joined: Wed Jan 07, 2015 9:53 pm

Re: ITs with more than 2 kids?

Post by Heimtun »

We were also accepted by Search with three kids, but decided at the last minute for logistical reasons to just go to Iowa for the fair and were hired there.
wrldtrvlr123
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Location: Japan

Re: ITs with more than 2 kids?

Post by wrldtrvlr123 »

I would take the doom and gloom posts with a grain of salt or two. As two teachers, having a 3rd child is not going to be a career killer. It MAY limit your options a bit, but many of the better schools will deal with it if they otherwise are interested in your candidacies. Ironically it may be more likely that 2nd tier and below schools (or smaller schools) may give you a pass with 3 kids (but then again being a teaching couple forgives much of your sin).

If you are that concerned then really put a push on to get somewhere (school and country) you want to be for a while and THEN have your 3rd child. Once you are in, they are certainly not going push you out for having another child.
shadowjack
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Re: ITs with more than 2 kids?

Post by shadowjack »

wrldtrvlr123,

theoretically they are not going to push you out. In reality, they may or they may not, especially if you have an incoming admin person or structural/financial changes around the school. Keep in mind, even at the good schools, you are on either a 1 or 2 year contract. The school does not have to renew it and is under no onus to do so if they choose not to, for whatever reason.

I would say having a third child overseas as a non-admin teaching couple might be risky in certain circumstances.

just my two halalas,

shad
wrldtrvlr123
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Location: Japan

Re: ITs with more than 2 kids?

Post by wrldtrvlr123 »

I guess anything is possible. I have known quite a few teaching couple with 3+ kids who worked at good schools that didn't seem to have a problem with it (ASIJ, ISBeijing, WAB etc). I wouldn't let the possibility deter me from having another child (if I god forbid wanted more than the one I have) but that's obviously a personal decision for the OP.
PsyGuy
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Joined: Wed Oct 12, 2011 9:51 am
Location: Northern Europe

Discussion

Post by PsyGuy »

@Bellarex

Its very very risky and hazardous advice to conclude that three kids is not going to matter. The majority of counter opinions assume (as wrldtrvlr identified) that you are working with and solely pursuing top tier ISs and while thats true family size is less a logistical issue at those ISs several factors contribute to that approach being extremely hazardous and risky:

1) The top tier ISs are a very, very small group of schools. ITs plan there whole career around getting into one of them, and many never do. It would be a different scenario if you were already at a top tier IS and were not planing on moving (retiring out) your not likely to be pushed out of one of them for having a third child, but your not in one of those schools yet.

2) Top tier schools are usually at capacity so those placement seats for your children are real money and represent a real lose in revenue compared to tuition paying students.

3) Why would a top tier IS spend more money that it has too. These ISs get 100s if not 1000s of applications, many, many of them just as capable educators as you, why spend more money for three kids when you dont have too. There is a reason that the majority of BKK fair successes are teaching couples with no kids and singles.

4) Your not top tier ready as an admin, your just starting out and a top tier school isnt going to hire externally for an unproven and inexperienced admin, this means your looking at third and second tier schools where family size is a real logistical issue.

Just because someone wins the lottery doesnt mean that person is going to be you, and just because there are ITs who break the trend does not in anyway mean youre going to be the next exception.
curiousme
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Re: ITs with more than 2 kids?

Post by curiousme »

"Just because someone wins the lottery doesnt mean that person is going to be you, and just because there are ITs who break the trend does not in anyway mean youre going to be the next exception."

But then again, you might be.
PsyGuy
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Joined: Wed Oct 12, 2011 9:51 am
Location: Northern Europe

Comment

Post by PsyGuy »

True, but if your wrong you cant undo having a child.
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