Talk to me about Shanghai - Living/Schools

[lemonlily]

In the other post about Shanghai, some teachers were talking about tier2s in Shanghai.

What are considered the tier2s or even tier3s in Shanghai? I know everyone's perspective is different, but it's all relatively the same.

Is it competitive to get into schools in Shanghai? I have kind of been targeting my search there, as I'd really like to go to a big exciting city again. I have spent the last two years in the Middle East and I am ready to move on. I am applying to other locations, but Shanghai is pretty much at the top of my list right now.

What is housing really like? I have looked at some stuff online. I understand they are pretty small, compared to western standards. But I was just looking at places in Hong Kong and apartments are very tiny and quite dumpy for a lot of money, at leas at the site I was using. Is it easier to find decent affordable housing in Shanghai? I am ok with living out of the city center. I am mostly just concerned with a decent kitchen with some counter space...Kitchens seem to be extremely small.

Do people just not care about housing much because there is so much to do/Shanghai is a great place to live? Or, is it much easier to find good places that what you can see on the internet?

[mysharona]

Just like anywhere else in the world, the quality of housing varies tremendously and it comes down to how much you want to spend. I have a 135 m2 ground floor apartment in downtown Shanghai and I pay 9500 RMB, thats roughly $1500/month. I have an oven, but many if not most apartments won't have a built in oven. Rather they will have counter top ovens which I have never had the pleasure of using.

My utilities aren't too bad, but I think you need to be careful because it appears that utilities have recently become tiered depending on where you live. I know my friends who live in primarily western compounds have seen their utility bills go up substantially this year when compared to last year. The nice thing about Shanghai is that transportation is easy and relatively cheap. The metro is extensive and trains are frequent and taxis are easy to use and numerous (except when its raining). I don't know whether Shanghai is any more competitive than anywhere else you might be applying. I would hate to guess at what the Tier system looks like because I don't really agree with it. If you are happy at a school then I would think that alone would make it Tier 1 no matter what any mythical rating system states.

[lemonlily]

[quote="mysharona"]Just like anywhere else in the world, the quality of housing varies tremendously and it comes down to how much you want to spend. I have a 135 m2 ground floor apartment in downtown Shanghai and I pay 9500 RMB, thats roughly $1500/month. I have an oven, but many if not most apartments won't have a built in oven. Rather they will have counter top ovens which I have never had the pleasure of using.

My utilities aren't too bad, but I think you need to be careful because it appears that utilities have recently become tiered depending on where you live. I know my friends who live in primarily western compounds have seen their utility bills go up substantially this year when compared to last year. The nice thing about Shanghai is that transportation is easy and relatively cheap. The metro is extensive and trains are frequent and taxis are easy to use and numerous (except when its raining). I don't know whether Shanghai is any more competitive than anywhere else you might be applying. I would hate to guess at what the Tier system looks like because I don't really agree with it. If you are happy at a school then I would think that alone would make it Tier 1 no matter what any mythical rating system states.[/quote]

Thanks for the information.

As far as tiers, I understand your point. Going off of your view, what schools in Shanghai have you heard of where teachers are generally happy? That's pretty much what I base my tiers off of as well, living comfortable and enjoying my school. I currently do not enjoy working at my school at all, so I am definitely looking for a school where teachers are generally happy and the environment is pleasant.

[Seansmith7]

If you end up in Shanghai, you can go to a local real estate/rental office, state your budget and size of flat, and soon, if not that day, they will show you some places. What I noticed is that there is often little correlation between price and quality. The agent will show you a dump for 8,000 rmb and then a decent place for the same price. It's the agent's duty to show the flats of all the landlords, so be patient and keep looking. You can also have 3 different real estate agents all working for you.

If you want the Shanghai Dream you can live in the French Concession (where I lived) or Jing'an. These areas are within walking distance or short cab/subway rides to the best restaurants, cafes, bars, nightlife, you name it. Expect to pay 6000 - 10,000 rmb per month for a 2 bedroom flat. You can live a little outside the centre (say, 6 subway stops), but with decent access to everything, and pay as little as 4,000 - 6000 rmb.

It's a great city with lots going on. The air pollution sucks at times. Still, if you can make it happen, go for it. Most expats I knew, including myself, had a great time.

[grdwdgrrrl]

We did over a decade in Shanghai and really loved it. Moved to see what it was like in other places. We miss the city, money and variety. Don't miss the pollution, lack of green spaces and difficulty in getting below the surface with the locals. You really should learn Mandarin to make the most of your stay. It helps you save money too. You should also learn some local Shanghai dialect so you don't get ripped off all the time. I think about returning all the time. I would worry about the air and water quality for my kids. That was a bit challenging when we were there. If we didn't have kids, we'd go back in a heart beat. Also, my kids grew up speaking Mandarin, something they are losing quickly now.
I have a little advice. When you have your first holiday, don't jet off to Thailand. Hang out in the city and bike around. Getting to know the city really helps with adjusting to life. The National Holiday is a great time because the city quiets down and you can bike around easily. Biking around is a nice way to get familiar.
So, there you go.

[rustersorven]

lemonlily wrote:
> In the other post about Shanghai, some teachers were talking about tier2s
> in Shanghai.
>
> What are considered the tier2s or even tier3s in Shanghai? I know
> everyone's perspective is different, but it's all relatively the same.
>
> Is it competitive to get into schools in Shanghai? I have kind of been
> targeting my search there, as I'd really like to go to a big exciting city
> again. I have spent the last two years in the Middle East and I am ready to
> move on. I am applying to other locations, but Shanghai is pretty much at
> the top of my list right now.
>
> What is housing really like? I have looked at some stuff online. I
> understand they are pretty small, compared to western standards. But I was
> just looking at places in Hong Kong and apartments are very tiny and quite
> dumpy for a lot of money, at leas at the site I was using. Is it easier to
> find decent affordable housing in Shanghai? I am ok with living out of the
> city center. I am mostly just concerned with a decent kitchen with some
> counter space...Kitchens seem to be extremely small.
>
> Do people just not care about housing much because there is so much to
> do/Shanghai is a great place to live? Or, is it much easier to find good
> places that what you can see on the internet?
In Hong Kong properties have exuberant price. I would suggest you look for a roommate rental.

[eion_padraig]

Hong Kong is vastly more expensive than anything in Mainland China, and Hong Kong has much smaller apartments that Shanghai (Beijing, Shenzhen, Guangzhou, you name it). The IS in Hong Kong don't cover housing either. That's the big (only?) downside to Hong Kong IS.

First and second tier schools should provide you with enough of a housing stipend for nice apartments in Shanghai. This is generally true of international schools in China, though not always the private and public Chinese schools with international curriculum. Of course there will be certain areas that will beige expensive than others and pricing can be very inconsistent in China. Foreigners have a difficult time getting as good a deal as locals. Also schools will probably want 'fapiaos' (receipts) which mean landlords will be taxed on their rental earnings which also increases rents. Still the kind of apartment you will be able to rent will be nice.

Shanghai has lots of IS. This means it's not hard to find a job there if you're qualified and you are not too picky. There is a lot to like about Shanghai, but it certainly doesn't appeal to everyone so there seems to be a steady amount of turnover even amongst the schools with deep pockets.

Be warned that SH is a place one could rapidly burn through your salary given the night life.

[lemonlily]

I have a non-teaching spouse, so roommates are not really an option for us.

We aren't much into the night life. We like to go out for a beer irregularly, but we currently live in a dry country, so it's not a huge deal for us. But we are definitely looking to move back to an exciting city....

I've heard that there are a ton of schools in Shanghai, but I haven't really been able to find them. I know of several, but I wonder if there are some that are not well known? I know all the ones that are registered with Search or have reviews on here, but that's all, and it doesn't seem like that many..

[shadowjack]

Eion, some schools do provide a housing allowance, but it is rolled into your total salary. You get a lump sum of money every year for flights, housing, salary - and it is up to you to divide it how you see fit.

[eion_padraig]

Well, if it's rolled into one's salary, then I'm not sure I'd call it a housing allowance myself. I'd probably think of it a salary.

[grdwdgrrrl]

British International School
Rego International School
Shanghai American School
Shanghai United (many campuses with different curriculums)
Singapore international School
YK Pao
Shanghai Community International School
Wellington
Yew Chung
French and German School
Then there are local schools that have international streams and have some foreign teachers and do combo curriculums, curricula?

Did I miss any?

Some do British curriculum, some American or AP, many do IB, Some do combos of an international and Chinese curriculum, one does a Canadian curriculum.

[eion_padraig]

Concordia
Western International School of Shanghai
SMIC School
Dulwich College

[grdwdgrrrl]

Thanks. How can I forget? Used to play softball out at Concordia. I've friends working at Dulwich. Friends' kids going to WISS. I've been away too long.

[ne14asnickers]

Learning Beyond Academy is a private, non-profit Christian school in Shanghai and is looking for teachers. It's in the same general area as Concordia and Dulwich.

[eion_padraig]

Concordia and Dulwich are in Jinqiao district in Pudong.

Wow, that LBA website is rather strange. I don't know what to make of it. Is the school for for kids of employees for Charity Dream Shanghai?