No interviews yet- should I be worried?
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OrangeSoda
- Posts: 40
- Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2013 3:29 pm
shadowjack, I haven't looked into the American schools because I am only experienced in the British Curriculum and not yet two full years. But if I can't even get an interview at the schools covering the British Curriculum then I have even less hope of an American school! I think I will sign up to Search but maybe the dream is now becoming a reality [in that it might not happen!]
Comment
@OrangeSoda
What schools are you applying too? I ask because really there are 2nd tier IGCSE schools out there that would be happy to have you on staff. If your only applying to top tier schools, your not really competitive for those schools.
The rule is when a school wants you they REALLY act like they want you. If your getting the form messages and emails from HR after waiting a week or so it means they dont want you. Your someone they might settle for at some distant point in the future, but they dont want you.
Your really just looking for excuses for the disappointment. I hate to be cruel, but its not your cover letter or lack of pictures, or anything else, its you, "theyre just not into you".
These dont matter but your cover letter shouldnt be longer then a page. If you have more (and its okay to have more) you put that into your "teaching philosophy" statement. Schools dont really read cover letters, so no matter how much time you put into it, its not getting read. Almost all cover letters say the same thing, and are basically you bragging about what a great teacher you are. A recruiter might skim it before an actual interview but thats about it.
You should include a photo, my advice is to include them as separate file in your email.
Yes schools and their online applications are a pain but the reason for them is very simple. They want a database of applicants, and among the many different ways of getting the data from your resume to their system, having you do the data entry yourself is the cheapest and easiest. Otherwise without a database they need REALLY big file cabinets and they need to hire someone to manage all those resumes.
What schools are you applying too? I ask because really there are 2nd tier IGCSE schools out there that would be happy to have you on staff. If your only applying to top tier schools, your not really competitive for those schools.
The rule is when a school wants you they REALLY act like they want you. If your getting the form messages and emails from HR after waiting a week or so it means they dont want you. Your someone they might settle for at some distant point in the future, but they dont want you.
Your really just looking for excuses for the disappointment. I hate to be cruel, but its not your cover letter or lack of pictures, or anything else, its you, "theyre just not into you".
These dont matter but your cover letter shouldnt be longer then a page. If you have more (and its okay to have more) you put that into your "teaching philosophy" statement. Schools dont really read cover letters, so no matter how much time you put into it, its not getting read. Almost all cover letters say the same thing, and are basically you bragging about what a great teacher you are. A recruiter might skim it before an actual interview but thats about it.
You should include a photo, my advice is to include them as separate file in your email.
Yes schools and their online applications are a pain but the reason for them is very simple. They want a database of applicants, and among the many different ways of getting the data from your resume to their system, having you do the data entry yourself is the cheapest and easiest. Otherwise without a database they need REALLY big file cabinets and they need to hire someone to manage all those resumes.
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OrangeSoda
- Posts: 40
- Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2013 3:29 pm
Re: Comment
[quote="PsyGuy"]@OrangeSoda
What schools are you applying too? I ask because really there are 2nd tier IGCSE schools out there that would be happy to have you on staff. If your only applying to top tier schools, your not really competitive for those schools.
The rule is when a school wants you they REALLY act like they want you. If your getting the form messages and emails from HR after waiting a week or so it means they dont want you. Your someone they might settle for at some distant point in the future, but they dont want you.
Your really just looking for excuses for the disappointment. I hate to be cruel, but its not your cover letter or lack of pictures, or anything else, its you, "theyre just not into you".
These dont matter but your cover letter shouldnt be longer then a page. If you have more (and its okay to have more) you put that into your "teaching philosophy" statement. Schools dont really read cover letters, so no matter how much time you put into it, its not getting read. Almost all cover letters say the same thing, and are basically you bragging about what a great teacher you are. A recruiter might skim it before an actual interview but thats about it.
You should include a photo, my advice is to include them as separate file in your email.
Yes schools and their online applications are a pain but the reason for them is very simple. They want a database of applicants, and among the many different ways of getting the data from your resume to their system, having you do the data entry yourself is the cheapest and easiest. Otherwise without a database they need REALLY big file cabinets and they need to hire someone to manage all those resumes.[/quote]
I understand your points PsyGuy and I agree, they must not be into me and my partner. Therefore, apart from experience I'm trying to think why they're not into me?
I will have to look into the tier system because I haven't looked at it that way and we have just applied to the schools offering both of our subjects.
Is there anything I can do to make me more employable or for them to be interested in the possibility of myself and my partner working in the same school?
I have noticed, for example, schools in Kuwait that say in their application they even welcome NQTs ! Maybe that's what I will have to look into to get some experience in the ME?
We are not picking these schools to be snobby or picky, it's just the ones we have found to have two vacancies for both of us.
What schools are you applying too? I ask because really there are 2nd tier IGCSE schools out there that would be happy to have you on staff. If your only applying to top tier schools, your not really competitive for those schools.
The rule is when a school wants you they REALLY act like they want you. If your getting the form messages and emails from HR after waiting a week or so it means they dont want you. Your someone they might settle for at some distant point in the future, but they dont want you.
Your really just looking for excuses for the disappointment. I hate to be cruel, but its not your cover letter or lack of pictures, or anything else, its you, "theyre just not into you".
These dont matter but your cover letter shouldnt be longer then a page. If you have more (and its okay to have more) you put that into your "teaching philosophy" statement. Schools dont really read cover letters, so no matter how much time you put into it, its not getting read. Almost all cover letters say the same thing, and are basically you bragging about what a great teacher you are. A recruiter might skim it before an actual interview but thats about it.
You should include a photo, my advice is to include them as separate file in your email.
Yes schools and their online applications are a pain but the reason for them is very simple. They want a database of applicants, and among the many different ways of getting the data from your resume to their system, having you do the data entry yourself is the cheapest and easiest. Otherwise without a database they need REALLY big file cabinets and they need to hire someone to manage all those resumes.[/quote]
I understand your points PsyGuy and I agree, they must not be into me and my partner. Therefore, apart from experience I'm trying to think why they're not into me?
I will have to look into the tier system because I haven't looked at it that way and we have just applied to the schools offering both of our subjects.
Is there anything I can do to make me more employable or for them to be interested in the possibility of myself and my partner working in the same school?
I have noticed, for example, schools in Kuwait that say in their application they even welcome NQTs ! Maybe that's what I will have to look into to get some experience in the ME?
We are not picking these schools to be snobby or picky, it's just the ones we have found to have two vacancies for both of us.
Last edited by OrangeSoda on Sat Feb 02, 2013 10:33 am, edited 1 time in total.
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OrangeSoda
- Posts: 40
- Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2013 3:29 pm
Re: Comment
[quote="OrangeSoda"][quote="PsyGuy"]@OrangeSoda
The rule is when a school wants you they REALLY act like they want you. If your getting the form messages and emails from HR after waiting a week or so it means they dont want you. Your someone they might settle for at some distant point in the future, but they dont want you.
Your really just looking for excuses for the disappointment. I hate to be cruel, but its not your cover letter or lack of pictures, or anything else, its you, "theyre just not into you".
[/quote]
I understand your points PsyGuy and I agree, they must not be into me and my partner. Therefore, apart from experience I'm trying to think why they're not into me?
I will have to look into the tier system because I haven't looked at it that way and we have just applied to the schools offering both of our subjects.
They have mostly said minimum two years experience, which we will have by July. It's a shame because we really do want to make an impact and be there for at least 6 years.
Is there anything I can do to make me more employable or for them to be interested in the possibility of myself and my partner working in the same school?
I have noticed, for example, schools in Kuwait that say in their application they even welcome NQTs ! Maybe that's what I will have to look into to get some experience in the ME?
We are not picking these schools to be snobby or picky, it's just the ones we have found to have two vacancies for both of us.[/quote]
The rule is when a school wants you they REALLY act like they want you. If your getting the form messages and emails from HR after waiting a week or so it means they dont want you. Your someone they might settle for at some distant point in the future, but they dont want you.
Your really just looking for excuses for the disappointment. I hate to be cruel, but its not your cover letter or lack of pictures, or anything else, its you, "theyre just not into you".
[/quote]
I understand your points PsyGuy and I agree, they must not be into me and my partner. Therefore, apart from experience I'm trying to think why they're not into me?
I will have to look into the tier system because I haven't looked at it that way and we have just applied to the schools offering both of our subjects.
They have mostly said minimum two years experience, which we will have by July. It's a shame because we really do want to make an impact and be there for at least 6 years.
Is there anything I can do to make me more employable or for them to be interested in the possibility of myself and my partner working in the same school?
I have noticed, for example, schools in Kuwait that say in their application they even welcome NQTs ! Maybe that's what I will have to look into to get some experience in the ME?
We are not picking these schools to be snobby or picky, it's just the ones we have found to have two vacancies for both of us.[/quote]
Last edited by OrangeSoda on Sat Feb 02, 2013 10:34 am, edited 1 time in total.
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shadowjack
- Posts: 2140
- Joined: Sat Oct 06, 2012 9:49 am
OrangeSoda,
why are you only targeting British Schools? By doing so, you eliminate the majority of international schools in the world.
Your skills carry over to other systems - it is the experience that many schools value.
I have taught in the British system, the American system, the Canadian system, and IB - while there are differences, a good teacher can teach in any of them. There will be mental adjustments - for example, you are used to the British band system and SOWs, while in the American/Canadian system you will have F to A+ grades on a percentage basis and have lesson and unit plans. The IB has similarities to the British national system.
If you have not signed up for TIEonline (which you can do almost instantaneously), do so. Post your resume/CV and start researching jobs at ALL the international schools posting vacancies.
Good luck!
PS While a lot of recruiting takes place at the fairs, don't worry that there are no jobs out there - jobs will continue to come along until the school year starts...Also, apply to those schools I mentioned above!
why are you only targeting British Schools? By doing so, you eliminate the majority of international schools in the world.
Your skills carry over to other systems - it is the experience that many schools value.
I have taught in the British system, the American system, the Canadian system, and IB - while there are differences, a good teacher can teach in any of them. There will be mental adjustments - for example, you are used to the British band system and SOWs, while in the American/Canadian system you will have F to A+ grades on a percentage basis and have lesson and unit plans. The IB has similarities to the British national system.
If you have not signed up for TIEonline (which you can do almost instantaneously), do so. Post your resume/CV and start researching jobs at ALL the international schools posting vacancies.
Good luck!
PS While a lot of recruiting takes place at the fairs, don't worry that there are no jobs out there - jobs will continue to come along until the school year starts...Also, apply to those schools I mentioned above!
Ugh, I'm in the same place--feel like I'm going nowhere fast and am resolved that I'll be staying in my current position for another year.
Me: 10 years overseas and 4 Int'l Schools (including an assistant teaching position at an Elite School early in my career).
5 years PYP experience
Masters in progress (June 2013)
Applying for Kindergarten and Early Elementary positions in Germany and therein lies my problem. My partner is German and I won't be leaving Germany (trust me it's hard enough to be resolved to this;) Totally frustrated that even after sending personalized resumes to what seems like every PYP school in Germany (except the ones I can tell I don't want to work at) I'm getting nothing. I know some positions will open later because the labor laws here are quite different and you have to give less notice.
Trying to decide if teaching an upper elementary class is something I'd want to do next year to diversify.
I have applied at some schools outside of Deutschland and gotten some positive interest.
Me: 10 years overseas and 4 Int'l Schools (including an assistant teaching position at an Elite School early in my career).
5 years PYP experience
Masters in progress (June 2013)
Applying for Kindergarten and Early Elementary positions in Germany and therein lies my problem. My partner is German and I won't be leaving Germany (trust me it's hard enough to be resolved to this;) Totally frustrated that even after sending personalized resumes to what seems like every PYP school in Germany (except the ones I can tell I don't want to work at) I'm getting nothing. I know some positions will open later because the labor laws here are quite different and you have to give less notice.
Trying to decide if teaching an upper elementary class is something I'd want to do next year to diversify.
I have applied at some schools outside of Deutschland and gotten some positive interest.
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OrangeSoda
- Posts: 40
- Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2013 3:29 pm
[quote="shadowjack"]
If you have not signed up for TIEonline (which you can do almost instantaneously), do so. Post your resume/CV and start researching jobs at ALL the international schools posting vacancies.
Good luck!
PS While a lot of recruiting takes place at the fairs, don't worry that there are no jobs out there - jobs will continue to come along until the school year starts...Also, apply to those schools I mentioned above![/quote]
Thank you once again shadowjack! :)
But I know a colleague of mine has had a couple of interviews, with the same amount of experience. So I really am concerned at this point! We did put in our cover letter that we want to be considered as a joint application [yes we did apply separately].
I think maybe it was naivety on my part as I was thinking well ahead e.g. in 10years if I want to come back to the UK maybe I will not get hired because I will have been working in an American school system?
Me and my partner will look at search associates and tie, we are also going to contact other agencies and ask for advice.
If you have not signed up for TIEonline (which you can do almost instantaneously), do so. Post your resume/CV and start researching jobs at ALL the international schools posting vacancies.
Good luck!
PS While a lot of recruiting takes place at the fairs, don't worry that there are no jobs out there - jobs will continue to come along until the school year starts...Also, apply to those schools I mentioned above![/quote]
Thank you once again shadowjack! :)
But I know a colleague of mine has had a couple of interviews, with the same amount of experience. So I really am concerned at this point! We did put in our cover letter that we want to be considered as a joint application [yes we did apply separately].
I think maybe it was naivety on my part as I was thinking well ahead e.g. in 10years if I want to come back to the UK maybe I will not get hired because I will have been working in an American school system?
Me and my partner will look at search associates and tie, we are also going to contact other agencies and ask for advice.
Last edited by OrangeSoda on Thu Jan 31, 2013 2:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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OrangeSoda
- Posts: 40
- Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2013 3:29 pm
[quote="seashell"]Ugh, I'm in the same place--feel like I'm going nowhere fast and am resolved that I'll be staying in my current position for another year.
Me: 10 years overseas and 4 Int'l Schools (including an assistant teaching position at an Elite School early in my career).
5 years PYP experience
Masters in progress (June 2013)
Applying for Kindergarten and Early Elementary positions in Germany and therein lies my problem. My partner is German and I won't be leaving Germany (trust me it's hard enough to be resolved to this;) Totally frustrated that even after sending personalized resumes to what seems like every PYP school in Germany (except the ones I can tell I don't want to work at) I'm getting nothing. I know some positions will open later because the labor laws here are quite different and you have to give less notice.
Trying to decide if teaching an upper elementary class is something I'd want to do next year to diversify.
I have applied at some schools outside of Deutschland and gotten some positive interest.[/quote]
You are much more experienced than we are, it will be a shame if you cannot move to the position and location you desire!
I think teaching in upper elementary is something which could give you a stronger case in your application, but I'm no expert! Hope it goes well!
Me: 10 years overseas and 4 Int'l Schools (including an assistant teaching position at an Elite School early in my career).
5 years PYP experience
Masters in progress (June 2013)
Applying for Kindergarten and Early Elementary positions in Germany and therein lies my problem. My partner is German and I won't be leaving Germany (trust me it's hard enough to be resolved to this;) Totally frustrated that even after sending personalized resumes to what seems like every PYP school in Germany (except the ones I can tell I don't want to work at) I'm getting nothing. I know some positions will open later because the labor laws here are quite different and you have to give less notice.
Trying to decide if teaching an upper elementary class is something I'd want to do next year to diversify.
I have applied at some schools outside of Deutschland and gotten some positive interest.[/quote]
You are much more experienced than we are, it will be a shame if you cannot move to the position and location you desire!
I think teaching in upper elementary is something which could give you a stronger case in your application, but I'm no expert! Hope it goes well!
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shadowjack
- Posts: 2140
- Joined: Sat Oct 06, 2012 9:49 am
If you had signed up with Search, you can search their database by position, spouse position, and type of program (IB, A Level, ICGSE, AP, and more), to see exactly what is out there for you. That is one of the values of Search.
TIEonline is not as organized, but it does have jobs that Search doesn't (and vice versa).
As to worrying about returning to England - when I applied in the UK, I sent my CV the morning of one day and woke up to the job offer (from a government school) the next morning - granted, this was when TES was posting 10,000 jobs for Easter term break...
But...if you plan to return in ten years, then after 6 years with your international experience, target more British schools - also target British schools in out of the way locations, such as West Africa, Sudan (International School of Khartoum offers ICGCSEs and A levels), Mongolia (British School of Ulaanbaatar), northern China or rural China - anywhere to get your foot on the ladder and tough it out for two years).
That said - you currently have jobs it seems, so you can always regroup, take the lessons you have learned, and do the same thing next year. Internationally, in many cases if you say you are going to a fair, your job is gone. So if you don't get a job, you have no job. Seems that pressure is not on you and your hubby/significant other?
TIEonline is not as organized, but it does have jobs that Search doesn't (and vice versa).
As to worrying about returning to England - when I applied in the UK, I sent my CV the morning of one day and woke up to the job offer (from a government school) the next morning - granted, this was when TES was posting 10,000 jobs for Easter term break...
But...if you plan to return in ten years, then after 6 years with your international experience, target more British schools - also target British schools in out of the way locations, such as West Africa, Sudan (International School of Khartoum offers ICGCSEs and A levels), Mongolia (British School of Ulaanbaatar), northern China or rural China - anywhere to get your foot on the ladder and tough it out for two years).
That said - you currently have jobs it seems, so you can always regroup, take the lessons you have learned, and do the same thing next year. Internationally, in many cases if you say you are going to a fair, your job is gone. So if you don't get a job, you have no job. Seems that pressure is not on you and your hubby/significant other?
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OrangeSoda
- Posts: 40
- Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2013 3:29 pm
[quote="shadowjack"]If you had signed up with Search, you can search their database by position, spouse position, and type of program (IB, A Level, ICGSE, AP, and more), to see exactly what is out there for you. That is one of the values of Search.
TIEonline is not as organized, but it does have jobs that Search doesn't (and vice versa).
[/quote]
Thanks again shadowjack! I guess we will try and be cover more angles next year if that's what it leads to and will sign up to search and TIE this weekend.
Well there is a massive funding cut in our school and they are going to lose the KS3 and KS4 element of it. I am only guaranteed part-time next year so instead of starting all over again at another school i wanted to fulfill my ambition of working overseas and seeing what impact I could have.
How do you rate the schools that actually advertise that they welcome applications from even NQTs. I'm guessing that's one way to find out it isn't a tier 1 school and they are desperate for any teacher?
TIEonline is not as organized, but it does have jobs that Search doesn't (and vice versa).
[/quote]
Thanks again shadowjack! I guess we will try and be cover more angles next year if that's what it leads to and will sign up to search and TIE this weekend.
Well there is a massive funding cut in our school and they are going to lose the KS3 and KS4 element of it. I am only guaranteed part-time next year so instead of starting all over again at another school i wanted to fulfill my ambition of working overseas and seeing what impact I could have.
How do you rate the schools that actually advertise that they welcome applications from even NQTs. I'm guessing that's one way to find out it isn't a tier 1 school and they are desperate for any teacher?
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shadowjack
- Posts: 2140
- Joined: Sat Oct 06, 2012 9:49 am
They might not be tier 1, but they are not all bog standard either.
Try AISK (American International School of Kuwait) or ASK (The American School of Kuwait), or BBS (Bayan Bilingual School, also in Kuwait)
They are not super schools, but they are solid and you can get on with teaching. I know good teachers who came from these schools to the school I taught at a few years ago.
Good luck! And I would recommend not necessarily taking any job just to have an international job, but to do your research...
Try AISK (American International School of Kuwait) or ASK (The American School of Kuwait), or BBS (Bayan Bilingual School, also in Kuwait)
They are not super schools, but they are solid and you can get on with teaching. I know good teachers who came from these schools to the school I taught at a few years ago.
Good luck! And I would recommend not necessarily taking any job just to have an international job, but to do your research...
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OrangeSoda
- Posts: 40
- Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2013 3:29 pm
As always shadowjack I thank you for the replies! I have been totally naive about the process because of people saying it's easy to get a job in the Middle East etc. but I have worked really hard on applications and and forms etc. but to no avail so far.
Is there a better chance of getting into a 'tier 1' school once you have a couple of years experience overseas?
Do you know much about Kuwait as a place to live? I've heard some mixes reviews.
Thanks a bunch!
Is there a better chance of getting into a 'tier 1' school once you have a couple of years experience overseas?
Do you know much about Kuwait as a place to live? I've heard some mixes reviews.
Thanks a bunch!
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shadowjack
- Posts: 2140
- Joined: Sat Oct 06, 2012 9:49 am
Tier 1 schools are schools you generally don't just walk into. They tend to hire from within the circuit, and teachers with quite a few years of experience in their teaching area. If they hire from the States or the UK, it is a strong candidate. However, if that candidate does not work out, they are down the road a couple of years later.
So you do your time and then after you have 2 - 4 years international experience, and ideally some IB or willingness to do IB, then you can go for the Tier 1 schools. Also, while you are at your present school overseas - network, network, network!
Kuwait is ok to live - we were back to visit a dear friend and his family there in 2008 after 8 years away. Lots of changes, but not a bad place. However, it can get small and insular and you need to develop interests other than shopping! Life there is what you make of it - it can be grand or horrible. You can also fill your time with tutoring, which makes it very rewarding financially and allows you to travel out at breaks...
So you do your time and then after you have 2 - 4 years international experience, and ideally some IB or willingness to do IB, then you can go for the Tier 1 schools. Also, while you are at your present school overseas - network, network, network!
Kuwait is ok to live - we were back to visit a dear friend and his family there in 2008 after 8 years away. Lots of changes, but not a bad place. However, it can get small and insular and you need to develop interests other than shopping! Life there is what you make of it - it can be grand or horrible. You can also fill your time with tutoring, which makes it very rewarding financially and allows you to travel out at breaks...
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OrangeSoda
- Posts: 40
- Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2013 3:29 pm
We have no problem working in a Tier 2 school and rolling up our sleeves and working hard to prove ourselves. It's just getting that chance. Even the IB is not an issue, I have had to learn a lot of new specifications in the past year and half because I am teaching from KS3-KS5 and that includes exam based, vocational subjects etc. So learning another is not an issue.
I think I have to start being more realistic instead of trying to live a dream that may not happen. I will start applying in the UK as well and if the ME does not happen this or next year then it will have to wait until quite a number of years as my priority will shift to having a family.
Thanks for your continuous advice shadowjack!
I think I have to start being more realistic instead of trying to live a dream that may not happen. I will start applying in the UK as well and if the ME does not happen this or next year then it will have to wait until quite a number of years as my priority will shift to having a family.
Thanks for your continuous advice shadowjack!
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shadowjack
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- Joined: Sat Oct 06, 2012 9:49 am