I am considering teaching internationally next school year. I'm currently an elementary teacher with 4 years of teaching experience. I have my Bachelor's degree in Interdisciplinary Studies (for Early/Elementary taching) and my Master's Degree in Teaching. I also graduated with a minor in a foreign language and an ESL certificate with my graduate program. I am married to someone who doesn't teach and we have two beautiful sons. I have solely worked in progressive private schools.
I know of two people (with families that have a non-teaching spouse) that have secured elementary teaching positions abroad.
I wanted to come here to get more information about it and to see what schools/regions I would be best suited for with my experience. Thank you for your feedback in advance!
Where can I teach next year?
My advice would be... 'keep your options open.' Most international schools at the moment will only hire a teacher with three dependents for hard to fill positions. They will also do it late in the game (after April). It's not impossible but it won't be easy and you will not be a first choice.
Your foreign language might be the ticket.
Your foreign language might be the ticket.
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Love4Teaching12
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- Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2012 2:14 pm
[quote="Glerky"]My advice would be... 'keep your options open.' Most international schools at the moment will only hire a teacher with three dependents for hard to fill positions. They will also do it late in the game (after April). It's not impossible but it won't be easy and you will not be a first choice.
Your foreign language might be the ticket.[/quote]
Oh, wow. That's not very good.
How would m foreign language be useful? Will they possibly have me teach using the language at some point?
Outside of International Schools, is there any other way I can teach elementary school abroad? I have always taught either 4th or 5th grade and feel that I'm an innovative teacher.
Your foreign language might be the ticket.[/quote]
Oh, wow. That's not very good.
How would m foreign language be useful? Will they possibly have me teach using the language at some point?
Outside of International Schools, is there any other way I can teach elementary school abroad? I have always taught either 4th or 5th grade and feel that I'm an innovative teacher.
Reply
Your going to be an expensive hire, and not very competitive. Your first complication is that you have a 1:4 travel ratio(1 teacher/4 travelers) which is going to be frustrating for you. Your going to hear "were waiting" a lot, and most of those arent going to result in offers.
The second complication is your just an elementary teacher which is in pretty low demand. ISs like to save their primary school positions for teaching couples where the front teacher has a high demand difficult to fill position and the spouse is primary. Many schools are going to have lots of cheaper candidates available for primary positions.
The third complication is that you only have 4 years experience, the bar to IS entry is two years so your not a veteran teacher yet. Lastly, You have no PYP experience which is going to reduce your marketability even further.
Your ESL certificate doesnt count.
What is your foreign language specifically? Are you fluent, proficient in it? Could you get certified to teach it? Would you be able to teach it?
No they will not ask you to teach in the foreign language, with the exception of some national schools the language of instruction in ISs is English.
The second complication is your just an elementary teacher which is in pretty low demand. ISs like to save their primary school positions for teaching couples where the front teacher has a high demand difficult to fill position and the spouse is primary. Many schools are going to have lots of cheaper candidates available for primary positions.
The third complication is that you only have 4 years experience, the bar to IS entry is two years so your not a veteran teacher yet. Lastly, You have no PYP experience which is going to reduce your marketability even further.
Your ESL certificate doesnt count.
What is your foreign language specifically? Are you fluent, proficient in it? Could you get certified to teach it? Would you be able to teach it?
No they will not ask you to teach in the foreign language, with the exception of some national schools the language of instruction in ISs is English.
I think saying you're "just an elementary school teacher" is just plain rude. Maybe you should choose your words a bit more carefully...and maybe knowing whether you should use you're when you're trying to say you are is something that you should review. This is an important grammatical distinction taught by fine men and women who are "just elementary school teachers."
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Love4Teaching12
- Posts: 6
- Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2012 2:14 pm
Re: Reply
[quote="PsyGuy"]Your going to be an expensive hire, and not very competitive. Your first complication is that you have a 1:4 travel ratio(1 teacher/4 travelers) which is going to be frustrating for you. Your going to hear "were waiting" a lot, and most of those arent going to result in offers.
The second complication is your just an elementary teacher which is in pretty low demand. ISs like to save their primary school positions for teaching couples where the front teacher has a high demand difficult to fill position and the spouse is primary. Many schools are going to have lots of cheaper candidates available for primary positions.
The third complication is that you only have 4 years experience, the bar to IS entry is two years so your not a veteran teacher yet. Lastly, You have no PYP experience which is going to reduce your marketability even further.
Your ESL certificate doesnt count.
What is your foreign language specifically? Are you fluent, proficient in it? Could you get certified to teach it? Would you be able to teach it?
No they will not ask you to teach in the foreign language, with the exception of some national schools the language of instruction in ISs is English.[/quote]
There are tons of families teaching in the International School system, isn't there?
Why wouldn't my ESL endorsement count? I have taken the required courses in my graduate program and am certified and qualified to teach ESL.
The second complication is your just an elementary teacher which is in pretty low demand. ISs like to save their primary school positions for teaching couples where the front teacher has a high demand difficult to fill position and the spouse is primary. Many schools are going to have lots of cheaper candidates available for primary positions.
The third complication is that you only have 4 years experience, the bar to IS entry is two years so your not a veteran teacher yet. Lastly, You have no PYP experience which is going to reduce your marketability even further.
Your ESL certificate doesnt count.
What is your foreign language specifically? Are you fluent, proficient in it? Could you get certified to teach it? Would you be able to teach it?
No they will not ask you to teach in the foreign language, with the exception of some national schools the language of instruction in ISs is English.[/quote]
There are tons of families teaching in the International School system, isn't there?
Why wouldn't my ESL endorsement count? I have taken the required courses in my graduate program and am certified and qualified to teach ESL.
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Love4Teaching12
- Posts: 6
- Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2012 2:14 pm
[quote="hmmmm"]I think saying you're "just an elementary school teacher" is just plain rude. Maybe you should choose your words a bit more carefully...and maybe knowing whether you should use you're when you're trying to say you are is something that you should review. This is an important grammatical distinction taught by fine men and women who are "just elementary school teachers."[/quote]
Well said!
Well said!
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Love4Teaching12
- Posts: 6
- Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2012 2:14 pm
Reply
@love4teaching12
I don't know if tons of families teaching is the appropriate measure. There are many teaching couples with families that are teaching in international schools, and that's the problem. Typically the ideal ratio is 1:1, meaning for every employee (teacher) they have one dependent (spouse, child). You don't have that because hubby isn't a teacher, so he doesn't get a dependent, and in fact becomes a dependent. You have 1 teacher and 3 dependents. That means to put one teacher in a primary classroom, as an admin I need to buy 4 airline tickets, give you a three bedroom apartment (or equivalent housing allowance), pay 4 insurance premiums, process 4 visas, and give you two tuition waivers. That's a lot of cost and expense to fill one classroom. Why would I do that when in primary, there are a whole bunch of cheaper options. I can get a single 20 something primary teacher, that's 1 ticket, a one bed room apartment, no tuition waivers, 1 visa and 1 insurance premium. Even better I can get a math/science teacher, and a spouse who teaches primary. That's 2 tickets, 2 premiums, 2 visas, and I fill TWO classrooms, and still only need a 1 bedroom apartment. I'm sorry but the IS recruitment world is much like the rest of the world, everyone wants the best, at the cheapest price. Admins dont do too well with the budget when they pay more then they have too.
Your ESL certificate doesn't count because you got it from your university as part of your grad degree. There are way too many ESL teachers out there with ESL certificates that don't wouldnt let them teach ESL in a public school in their home country. Government agencies certify and credential "real" professional teachers, and there are so many ESL teachers that aren't professional teachers that many recruiters just dismiss anything that has ESL in it. That's what your ESL certificate sounds like to me. All of your teaching has been in private schools, and unless your teaching credential also includes an ESL endorsement, it sounds like every other non professional RSL certificate.
@hmmmm
Yes elementary teachers are fine outstanding professional men and woman, but that and any other characteristic and attribute that you attach to them is true of every other teacher as well. Then when you get all the teachers in the same room you have one REALLY BIG group of fine outstanding 20 something blonde pretty young woman primary teachers near the window, and a REALLY SMALL group of fine outstanding glasses wearing geeky male math teachers. In this field smaller means less competition, more demand, and overall better marketability. It's just basic economics of supply and demand, and everyone or their spouse has a primary qualification.
I don't know if tons of families teaching is the appropriate measure. There are many teaching couples with families that are teaching in international schools, and that's the problem. Typically the ideal ratio is 1:1, meaning for every employee (teacher) they have one dependent (spouse, child). You don't have that because hubby isn't a teacher, so he doesn't get a dependent, and in fact becomes a dependent. You have 1 teacher and 3 dependents. That means to put one teacher in a primary classroom, as an admin I need to buy 4 airline tickets, give you a three bedroom apartment (or equivalent housing allowance), pay 4 insurance premiums, process 4 visas, and give you two tuition waivers. That's a lot of cost and expense to fill one classroom. Why would I do that when in primary, there are a whole bunch of cheaper options. I can get a single 20 something primary teacher, that's 1 ticket, a one bed room apartment, no tuition waivers, 1 visa and 1 insurance premium. Even better I can get a math/science teacher, and a spouse who teaches primary. That's 2 tickets, 2 premiums, 2 visas, and I fill TWO classrooms, and still only need a 1 bedroom apartment. I'm sorry but the IS recruitment world is much like the rest of the world, everyone wants the best, at the cheapest price. Admins dont do too well with the budget when they pay more then they have too.
Your ESL certificate doesn't count because you got it from your university as part of your grad degree. There are way too many ESL teachers out there with ESL certificates that don't wouldnt let them teach ESL in a public school in their home country. Government agencies certify and credential "real" professional teachers, and there are so many ESL teachers that aren't professional teachers that many recruiters just dismiss anything that has ESL in it. That's what your ESL certificate sounds like to me. All of your teaching has been in private schools, and unless your teaching credential also includes an ESL endorsement, it sounds like every other non professional RSL certificate.
@hmmmm
Yes elementary teachers are fine outstanding professional men and woman, but that and any other characteristic and attribute that you attach to them is true of every other teacher as well. Then when you get all the teachers in the same room you have one REALLY BIG group of fine outstanding 20 something blonde pretty young woman primary teachers near the window, and a REALLY SMALL group of fine outstanding glasses wearing geeky male math teachers. In this field smaller means less competition, more demand, and overall better marketability. It's just basic economics of supply and demand, and everyone or their spouse has a primary qualification.
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Love4Teaching12
- Posts: 6
- Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2012 2:14 pm
Re: Reply
[quote="PsyGuy"]@love4teaching12
I don't know if tons of families teaching is the appropriate measure. There are many teaching couples with families that are teaching in international schools, and that's the problem. Typically the ideal ratio is 1:1, meaning for every employee (teacher) they have one dependent (spouse, child). You don't have that because hubby isn't a teacher, so he doesn't get a dependent, and in fact becomes a dependent. You have 1 teacher and 3 dependents. That means to put one teacher in a primary classroom, as an admin I need to buy 4 airline tickets, give you a three bedroom apartment (or equivalent housing allowance), pay 4 insurance premiums, process 4 visas, and give you two tuition waivers. That's a lot of cost and expense to fill one classroom. Why would I do that when in primary, there are a whole bunch of cheaper options. I can get a single 20 something primary teacher, that's 1 ticket, a one bed room apartment, no tuition waivers, 1 visa and 1 insurance premium. Even better I can get a math/science teacher, and a spouse who teaches primary. That's 2 tickets, 2 premiums, 2 visas, and I fill TWO classrooms, and still only need a 1 bedroom apartment. I'm sorry but the IS recruitment world is much like the rest of the world, everyone wants the best, at the cheapest price. Admins dont do too well with the budget when they pay more then they have too.
Your ESL certificate doesn't count because you got it from your university as part of your grad degree. There are way too many ESL teachers out there with ESL certificates that don't wouldnt let them teach ESL in a public school in their home country. Government agencies certify and credential "real" professional teachers, and there are so many ESL teachers that aren't professional teachers that many recruiters just dismiss anything that has ESL in it. That's what your ESL certificate sounds like to me. All of your teaching has been in private schools, and unless your teaching credential also includes an ESL endorsement, it sounds like every other non professional RSL certificate.
@hmmmm
Yes elementary teachers are fine outstanding professional men and woman, but that and any other characteristic and attribute that you attach to them is true of every other teacher as well. Then when you get all the teachers in the same room you have one REALLY BIG group of fine outstanding 20 something blonde pretty young woman primary teachers near the window, and a REALLY SMALL group of fine outstanding glasses wearing geeky male math teachers. In this field smaller means less competition, more demand, and overall better marketability. It's just basic economics of supply and demand, and everyone or their spouse has a primary qualification.[/quote]
Thanks for that. That does make sense as to why I would be a last choice. Is there any other endorsement I can get that would heighten my chances of being hired? I do enjoy environmental science, but I am not sure if that is something I can receive an endorsement in.
No, that's my point that I am expressing. I have an ESL endorsement through my state, due to the graduate classes I've taken in my program. It's not just a certificate. I am qualified to teach ESL as a professional and am eligible to be hired in the public school system here in the US.
I don't know if tons of families teaching is the appropriate measure. There are many teaching couples with families that are teaching in international schools, and that's the problem. Typically the ideal ratio is 1:1, meaning for every employee (teacher) they have one dependent (spouse, child). You don't have that because hubby isn't a teacher, so he doesn't get a dependent, and in fact becomes a dependent. You have 1 teacher and 3 dependents. That means to put one teacher in a primary classroom, as an admin I need to buy 4 airline tickets, give you a three bedroom apartment (or equivalent housing allowance), pay 4 insurance premiums, process 4 visas, and give you two tuition waivers. That's a lot of cost and expense to fill one classroom. Why would I do that when in primary, there are a whole bunch of cheaper options. I can get a single 20 something primary teacher, that's 1 ticket, a one bed room apartment, no tuition waivers, 1 visa and 1 insurance premium. Even better I can get a math/science teacher, and a spouse who teaches primary. That's 2 tickets, 2 premiums, 2 visas, and I fill TWO classrooms, and still only need a 1 bedroom apartment. I'm sorry but the IS recruitment world is much like the rest of the world, everyone wants the best, at the cheapest price. Admins dont do too well with the budget when they pay more then they have too.
Your ESL certificate doesn't count because you got it from your university as part of your grad degree. There are way too many ESL teachers out there with ESL certificates that don't wouldnt let them teach ESL in a public school in their home country. Government agencies certify and credential "real" professional teachers, and there are so many ESL teachers that aren't professional teachers that many recruiters just dismiss anything that has ESL in it. That's what your ESL certificate sounds like to me. All of your teaching has been in private schools, and unless your teaching credential also includes an ESL endorsement, it sounds like every other non professional RSL certificate.
@hmmmm
Yes elementary teachers are fine outstanding professional men and woman, but that and any other characteristic and attribute that you attach to them is true of every other teacher as well. Then when you get all the teachers in the same room you have one REALLY BIG group of fine outstanding 20 something blonde pretty young woman primary teachers near the window, and a REALLY SMALL group of fine outstanding glasses wearing geeky male math teachers. In this field smaller means less competition, more demand, and overall better marketability. It's just basic economics of supply and demand, and everyone or their spouse has a primary qualification.[/quote]
Thanks for that. That does make sense as to why I would be a last choice. Is there any other endorsement I can get that would heighten my chances of being hired? I do enjoy environmental science, but I am not sure if that is something I can receive an endorsement in.
No, that's my point that I am expressing. I have an ESL endorsement through my state, due to the graduate classes I've taken in my program. It's not just a certificate. I am qualified to teach ESL as a professional and am eligible to be hired in the public school system here in the US.
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Teachermom
- Posts: 59
- Joined: Wed Nov 28, 2012 7:14 am
- Location: Asia
Though I do concur that you aren't as competitive as a teacher with similar qualifications and fewer family members, don't give up hope just because you have 3 dependents. Just expect that you might need to take a job with a second tier school. There are still many great ones out there; just read up on them to really understand what you're getting into.
Also, you'll probably need to go somewhere where one salary could support you all. That means Europe and Japan are out since their cost of living is high.
Expect to really have to sell yourself. If you can figure out how to get another endorsement from your State, then do that to make yourself more marketable.
You still have a chance!
Also, you'll probably need to go somewhere where one salary could support you all. That means Europe and Japan are out since their cost of living is high.
Expect to really have to sell yourself. If you can figure out how to get another endorsement from your State, then do that to make yourself more marketable.
You still have a chance!
Psy Guy,
I am clear on the supply/demand side of teaching.
I would, however, never say "you are just a (fill in the blank)" to anyone as it is incredibly rude and demeaning.
I wasn't challenging your extensive knowledge of everything pertaining to every international school in the whole world, I was calling you out for being rude.
I am clear on the supply/demand side of teaching.
I would, however, never say "you are just a (fill in the blank)" to anyone as it is incredibly rude and demeaning.
I wasn't challenging your extensive knowledge of everything pertaining to every international school in the whole world, I was calling you out for being rude.
Reply
I care about the data, not feelings. There are enough therapist and cheerleaders on this forum and the world to hold peoples hands and tell them everything is going to be OK. Every year many teachers come to the end of August without a contract, and life is very "NOT" okay.
Data is important but so are Tact and Politeness.
"I care about the data, not feelings. There are enough therapist and cheerleaders on this forum and the world to hold peoples hands and tell them everything is going to be OK. Every year many teachers come to the end of August without a contract, and life is very "NOT" okay."
No doubt what Psyguy says a lot of the time are right and this is the big bad world. However it is very important indeed to try to be nice to people in general and tactful when dealing with others.
Just because you think you are extremely well put together person in every aspect in your own mind do spare a thought to others who are less than fortunate than you are Psyguy. A measure of greatness and intellect are respect for others. I am not saying that you should sugar coat any unpleasantness but it would be reasonable to expect a courtesy differentiating what we call civilised behaviour to the uncouthness and nepotism which tend to be rife in some instances in the country that we find ourselves.
For you to call the other person "just an elementary teacher is cheeky and rude. Why? Just because "she" has 3 dependants "a husband and 2 children". Therefore it renders her as slightly unemployable because of that? Understood that she has not as much experience as Psysh thought she should have. There have been instances where it is the male teacher with the same ratio of dependence and same kind of qualification. So will Psyguy says the same thing that the male teacher is unemployable. I find Psyguy attitude extremely overbearing and sexist. Furthermore the fact that the lady in question has an additional ESL qualification which was outrightly dismissed by this paragon of virtue and genius is disgusting and humiliating to me. Tact and courtesy my friend should be extended to people most of the time. So if you are so great Psyguy why arent you be working as the administration/director/principal of most of the top schools every where by now.
The lady might not have the top qualification that you seemed to intimate that you amply possessed to work but I am sure if she looked at herself positively and not being negative about it then she can contribute to the international community. We are now in the 21st century and there are other aspects of our own continuing self education which can benefit the children in the International Community and this should be put forward during interviews. No one is perfect less of all you Psyguy especially your condescending attitude towards the lady in question!
No doubt what Psyguy says a lot of the time are right and this is the big bad world. However it is very important indeed to try to be nice to people in general and tactful when dealing with others.
Just because you think you are extremely well put together person in every aspect in your own mind do spare a thought to others who are less than fortunate than you are Psyguy. A measure of greatness and intellect are respect for others. I am not saying that you should sugar coat any unpleasantness but it would be reasonable to expect a courtesy differentiating what we call civilised behaviour to the uncouthness and nepotism which tend to be rife in some instances in the country that we find ourselves.
For you to call the other person "just an elementary teacher is cheeky and rude. Why? Just because "she" has 3 dependants "a husband and 2 children". Therefore it renders her as slightly unemployable because of that? Understood that she has not as much experience as Psysh thought she should have. There have been instances where it is the male teacher with the same ratio of dependence and same kind of qualification. So will Psyguy says the same thing that the male teacher is unemployable. I find Psyguy attitude extremely overbearing and sexist. Furthermore the fact that the lady in question has an additional ESL qualification which was outrightly dismissed by this paragon of virtue and genius is disgusting and humiliating to me. Tact and courtesy my friend should be extended to people most of the time. So if you are so great Psyguy why arent you be working as the administration/director/principal of most of the top schools every where by now.
The lady might not have the top qualification that you seemed to intimate that you amply possessed to work but I am sure if she looked at herself positively and not being negative about it then she can contribute to the international community. We are now in the 21st century and there are other aspects of our own continuing self education which can benefit the children in the International Community and this should be put forward during interviews. No one is perfect less of all you Psyguy especially your condescending attitude towards the lady in question!