I'll get to the point:
- Bachelors in physics
- I'm a physics and chemistry teacher with two years experience with AP
- Certified by state of Florida to teach math as well
- My wife has a bachelors in health and is certified to teach biology and chemistry (2 years experience)
- we have no dependents and are both 25 years old
Were on a waiting list for Cambridge and looks like our only "official" option would be to attend San Fran. I've sent emails out and filled many applications with schools who need a physics/math/chemistry teacher but haven't gotten any replies.
Would it be okay for us to show up to Cambridge with no invitation anyway? I've read this as an option before but don't know how to go about it.
Thanks for any and all advice.
Kristian
Rogue Physics Teacher
Advice
Well "OK" is going to depend on who you ask. Search isnt going to say its OK, and the candidates who have invitations aren't going to like the competition (and your pretty marketable), but none of them are going to help you get a job, or get you a job.
It's pretty easy actually, you buy airline tickets and book a room at the hotel. That's pretty much all the fair is. You won't be able to go to sign, the social or use the candidate room (well not without taking more risks). Aside from those the fair is just people meeting in hotel rooms.
The key to this working though, is you have to have schools willing to meet and interview you in advance, otherwise its just going to be an expensive weekend. You want to mark your Search profile as going to the Cambridge fair anyway, so that schools that are searching for candidates will email you. You can also still search from the hotel and apply with schools while there. You can also slip a hanging file folder into the teacher boxes in the candidate room, so that you can receive messages from schools. You an also send messages and put resumes in the schools folders. You can wonder in and out of the candidate room without anyone giving you problems as long as you don't spend much time in there. You could go to the social, it's dark, and people don't always wear their name tags and talk up the recruiters. The hardest is sign up, but you could buy some name tag card stock, and some holders, and print your own, you will need a packet of random and different colored stickers, to make sure yours matches, but that's only a couple hours.
It's pretty easy actually, you buy airline tickets and book a room at the hotel. That's pretty much all the fair is. You won't be able to go to sign, the social or use the candidate room (well not without taking more risks). Aside from those the fair is just people meeting in hotel rooms.
The key to this working though, is you have to have schools willing to meet and interview you in advance, otherwise its just going to be an expensive weekend. You want to mark your Search profile as going to the Cambridge fair anyway, so that schools that are searching for candidates will email you. You can also still search from the hotel and apply with schools while there. You can also slip a hanging file folder into the teacher boxes in the candidate room, so that you can receive messages from schools. You an also send messages and put resumes in the schools folders. You can wonder in and out of the candidate room without anyone giving you problems as long as you don't spend much time in there. You could go to the social, it's dark, and people don't always wear their name tags and talk up the recruiters. The hardest is sign up, but you could buy some name tag card stock, and some holders, and print your own, you will need a packet of random and different colored stickers, to make sure yours matches, but that's only a couple hours.
REALLY
Stupid advice - but given its provenance, that isn't a surprise:
"You can also still search from the hotel and apply with schools while there. You can also slip a hanging file folder into the teacher boxes in the candidate room, so that you can receive messages from schools. You an also send messages and put resumes in the schools folders. You can wonder in and out of the candidate room without anyone giving you problems as long as you don't spend much time in there. You could go to the social, it's dark, and people don't always wear their name tags and talk up the recruiters. The hardest is sign up, but you could buy some name tag card stock, and some holders, and print your own, you will need a packet of random and different colored stickers, to make sure yours matches, but that's only a couple hours."
I go to a lot of SEARCH fairs and every year at every fair recruiters are told about such and such a candidate who is trying to scam his way in to interviews without being registered. My own guess is that recruiters are often the ones who turn in such candidates. If you follow Dave Jaw's advice and get caught, as you likely will be, then SEARCH may well blacklist you.
Of course you can go to the hotel and try to see recruiters on a pre-arranged basis - but only on the days outside the fair itself. Just don't do what this dimwit advises and go down the path of going into the candidate room or attending the social or anything else that will really annoy the fair organizers and maybe the recruiters as well.
"You can also still search from the hotel and apply with schools while there. You can also slip a hanging file folder into the teacher boxes in the candidate room, so that you can receive messages from schools. You an also send messages and put resumes in the schools folders. You can wonder in and out of the candidate room without anyone giving you problems as long as you don't spend much time in there. You could go to the social, it's dark, and people don't always wear their name tags and talk up the recruiters. The hardest is sign up, but you could buy some name tag card stock, and some holders, and print your own, you will need a packet of random and different colored stickers, to make sure yours matches, but that's only a couple hours."
I go to a lot of SEARCH fairs and every year at every fair recruiters are told about such and such a candidate who is trying to scam his way in to interviews without being registered. My own guess is that recruiters are often the ones who turn in such candidates. If you follow Dave Jaw's advice and get caught, as you likely will be, then SEARCH may well blacklist you.
Of course you can go to the hotel and try to see recruiters on a pre-arranged basis - but only on the days outside the fair itself. Just don't do what this dimwit advises and go down the path of going into the candidate room or attending the social or anything else that will really annoy the fair organizers and maybe the recruiters as well.
I was contacted by SEARCH and you are all correct about this not being a good idea. I'd rather not risk getting kicked out and just hope for the best by playing by the rules. I didn't realize just how serious it was.
In any case. Thank you Psyguy, Walter, and Sid for your advice; as always, I get a little smarter with every post that I read.
Kristian
In any case. Thank you Psyguy, Walter, and Sid for your advice; as always, I get a little smarter with every post that I read.
Kristian
Comment
None of that is true. Everything has risks. If your a guest of the hotel, your free to meet with anyone you want in anyone elses room. Grown adults can do whatever they legally want. You can meet and interview during fair times as well. Its fear mongering to suggest youll be escorted from the hotel by security, for what being in another adults room and talking? You may very well get blacklisted by Search if they catch you, thats why they have invitations in the first place. They arent going to pat you on the back, and praise your ambition. Thats why its called going "rogue". You didnt really expect them to say "sure thats OK" did you?
So what if they do, if Search is pushing you into a late recruiting fair, what does that and following the rules do for you? Who cares if they drop you. No one is going to protect your interests better then you. I know of a number of rogue candidates who did exactly that, they got offers, and contracts and are international teachers. Nothing horrible happened.
Lastly, schools and recruiters love the idea of hiring an unofficial candidate, they dont have to pay Search or ISS its recruitment fee.
So what if they do, if Search is pushing you into a late recruiting fair, what does that and following the rules do for you? Who cares if they drop you. No one is going to protect your interests better then you. I know of a number of rogue candidates who did exactly that, they got offers, and contracts and are international teachers. Nothing horrible happened.
Lastly, schools and recruiters love the idea of hiring an unofficial candidate, they dont have to pay Search or ISS its recruitment fee.
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lifeisnotsobad
- Posts: 133
- Joined: Tue May 13, 2008 3:37 pm
Comment
No ive considered it, there is no risk for schools. Search makes their money off the schools. They arent going to say good buy to tens of thousands of dollars over a side hire. They will punish the teacher by droping them, but a school that hires 10 teachers through Search, and pays the invoice for them ($15K), doesnt have to worry about a couple of side hires. It happens all the time, schools and recruiters are always looking for a way to avoid paying the recruiting fees. Thats why schools recruit from multiple sources, and why Search is so adamant about being notified the minute youve signed a contract and no longer available. The longer the time frame, the more likely the school can be successful at claiming they recruited from another source. Search has it worked into their business model a certain percentage of "loss" or "shrinkage".
Schools dont really need Search, there are many other recruiting sites that charge per vacancy posting, not per hire.
Search doesnt drop a school except for truly bad conduct that makes Search look bad. Business's dont drop customers/clients as long as they are profitable.
Search isnt so much one organization/agency. They are more like a medical group, with each associate operating independently under one umbrella firm. The associates provide their own services how the see fit (from representing teachers, to running their fairs), and invoice schools and teachers. They then pass a percentage of their revenue on to the firm.
So an associate lets call him "Joe" has a roster of teachers that he represents. Say teacher "Jane" is hired by IS Genovia. Joe wants to find out as soon as that happens so that he can invoice (bill) IS Genovia $1,500 for the hire. IS Genovia pays Joe for Jane and 3 other hires ($6,000). Now another associate, lets call her "Jennifer" hires a teacher "Bob" on the side. Bob doesnt report to Search that hes been hired, and 6 months pass until August comes and Bob finally updates his profile that hes no longer available. Jennifer emails Bob and he says hes working at IS Genovia. So the associate Jennifer sends an invoice to IS Genovia, but IS Genovia says they recruited the teacher from their own HR site, and they forward the online application that Bob completed for the school. However, IS Genovia has an invoice from Jennifer for three other teachers and one administrator ($7K, $1,500 per teacher, and $2,500 for the admin) and there may be more in the future as IS Genovia is also looking for 6 other vacancies. So heres the problem, First, Jennifer would have to get the vote and approval of the other Associates including Joe who IS Genovia has paid for his invoiced hires, additionally, IS Genovia has an application from the HR site, and its been 6 months since the fair. Why would Joe (and the other associates) dump a paying revenue source? Second, why would Jennifer dump a revenue source that has made her $7K and could easily make her more this year, and in years to come over $1,500? The answer is Jennifer isnt, she's just going to write of the loss as a tax deduction, and move on.
Schools dont really need Search, there are many other recruiting sites that charge per vacancy posting, not per hire.
Search doesnt drop a school except for truly bad conduct that makes Search look bad. Business's dont drop customers/clients as long as they are profitable.
Search isnt so much one organization/agency. They are more like a medical group, with each associate operating independently under one umbrella firm. The associates provide their own services how the see fit (from representing teachers, to running their fairs), and invoice schools and teachers. They then pass a percentage of their revenue on to the firm.
So an associate lets call him "Joe" has a roster of teachers that he represents. Say teacher "Jane" is hired by IS Genovia. Joe wants to find out as soon as that happens so that he can invoice (bill) IS Genovia $1,500 for the hire. IS Genovia pays Joe for Jane and 3 other hires ($6,000). Now another associate, lets call her "Jennifer" hires a teacher "Bob" on the side. Bob doesnt report to Search that hes been hired, and 6 months pass until August comes and Bob finally updates his profile that hes no longer available. Jennifer emails Bob and he says hes working at IS Genovia. So the associate Jennifer sends an invoice to IS Genovia, but IS Genovia says they recruited the teacher from their own HR site, and they forward the online application that Bob completed for the school. However, IS Genovia has an invoice from Jennifer for three other teachers and one administrator ($7K, $1,500 per teacher, and $2,500 for the admin) and there may be more in the future as IS Genovia is also looking for 6 other vacancies. So heres the problem, First, Jennifer would have to get the vote and approval of the other Associates including Joe who IS Genovia has paid for his invoiced hires, additionally, IS Genovia has an application from the HR site, and its been 6 months since the fair. Why would Joe (and the other associates) dump a paying revenue source? Second, why would Jennifer dump a revenue source that has made her $7K and could easily make her more this year, and in years to come over $1,500? The answer is Jennifer isnt, she's just going to write of the loss as a tax deduction, and move on.
PG probably has a point about limited risk to the school. However, recruiters don't make decisions based only on risk. Most also have a moral compass.
As for the risk to the rogue teacher, being in the hotel and letting schools know it, that's not really a risk. It may or may not get you interviews, but it's unlikely to result in any dramatic downside.
But sneaking into the fair, into the areas that the agency has paid for... that's a big risk. If you're caught, which is far likelier than PG believes, at the least you'll be publicly embarrassed, and schools will be warned of your presence and officially asked not to do any business with you. If schools do business with you after that, than they do face repercussions from the agency. And frankly, you're not worth. Pretty much no individual teacher is.
Not to mention that in the application process, you're trying to impress recruiters with your overall package. If your moral compass has you sneaking into fairs and private areas/events, what does that say to the recruiter? Personally I wouldn't be interested. I wouldn't mind if you were just taking a room in the hotel and contacting me privately through e-mail and non-fair channels. But if you violate the rules, your morals don't match mine, and they don't recommend you.
As for the risk to the rogue teacher, being in the hotel and letting schools know it, that's not really a risk. It may or may not get you interviews, but it's unlikely to result in any dramatic downside.
But sneaking into the fair, into the areas that the agency has paid for... that's a big risk. If you're caught, which is far likelier than PG believes, at the least you'll be publicly embarrassed, and schools will be warned of your presence and officially asked not to do any business with you. If schools do business with you after that, than they do face repercussions from the agency. And frankly, you're not worth. Pretty much no individual teacher is.
Not to mention that in the application process, you're trying to impress recruiters with your overall package. If your moral compass has you sneaking into fairs and private areas/events, what does that say to the recruiter? Personally I wouldn't be interested. I wouldn't mind if you were just taking a room in the hotel and contacting me privately through e-mail and non-fair channels. But if you violate the rules, your morals don't match mine, and they don't recommend you.