I would recommend you finish your counseling practicum first before trying to head overseas. Even though your husband is credentialed to teach math, since his studies were in history and political science, I think you will still be the one schools are most interested in once you have a credential.

Also, I've only seen one intern school counselor position through TIE, and none through Search. I don't know if these are meant for those still working on their degree, but I suspect not. You can check with Search about their policies. My understanding is that without 2 years experience they will want you listed as an intern, but they may not do this for a school counselors.

I knew a fellow who completed his MA by interning at an international school; an elite one with a rather large school counseling staff. I don't think it was paid, and I don't know if this qualified him for a credential back in the US. The school is one that is accredited by a North American accrediation organization and the school counselors were all credentialed, so maybe this was enough. The international school where he eventually ended up as was decidedly 3rd tier, in a country that may not have required him to be credentialed.

If you're planning on staying overseas long-term, you really want a school counseling credential because without it there are countries where you cannot be hired (I know Singapore is one). It's entirely possible that countries that now allow non-credentialed school counselors may not in the future. The unpaid internships that last a semester or a year that you have to do on to finish the program admitedly stink, but they're hard to find a work around.

If you are thinking about being a high school counselor, I would say you may want to consider attending the OACAC conference this summer (July). It's a conference focusing on international university admission, which is a large part of most high school positions at international schools. It's an excellent chance for professional development related to university admissions, but even more important for you would be the chance to meet international school counselors. It's a good place to hear about upcoming positions. Obviously this means footing the cost yourself. Every year this conference fills up, so if you are interested in attending make sure you don't wait too log to register once it goes up. It's being hosted at Marist College in Poughkeepsie, NY.

Another solid looking professional development opportunity that I've seen lately is something called Counseling Training Center which is associated with Principal's Training Center. They have something in Miami this July on international university counseling. They also have two programs in London, UK in June focused on more general issues for international school counselors. I know one of the people who is a facilitator, and that individual is a very good, intelligent presenter. These programs look at bit expensive; it looks like it is designed for schools to pay for the training so I'd be relectant to pay for training myself.

Again, this is my opinion. I hope it's useful. Good luck.

@Durianfan

Congratulations on your job.

@newcounsel

Great to hear about the interest you're getting. Good luck with the Skype interview.

There end up being counseling postions open even in March, April, and May. I was scoping out jobs on TIE last year, and there were new counseling positions being posted in those months, aside from postings that were up from earlier in the year.

I agree with Inman's suggestion to keep Shadowjack's post up with a sticky if the gods of ISR are listening.

I just thought his posts were well written too, especially considering they came following a grueling day of fair attendance.

Shadowjack, good luck with your search.

@Shadowjack

Wonderful write-up. Good luck tomorrow.

@autumnrain

Please don't take SighGuy's comments too seriously. He overstates and misinforms a lot of people. From your post, I don't know if you've been working overseas already or not. don't know of a resource where you can look up this by country as it would relate to international teachers. Someone else might, but I doubt anyone would have compiled a list like that specifically. And even if they had, a list like that could soon be out of date with shifts in law.

If you're a Search candidate, the database will indicate hiring limitations by the country where the school is located. If you have access to the database you could look at schools in different countries to see what is listed. This does not necessarily indicate a particular school's hiring policies, so some schools may avoid hiring people closing in on that age. TIEOnline's database also has something about age restrictions and comments, but again school policies and preferences can differ.

As I understand it, sometimes (certain countries) you can work beyond a retirement age if you have already received a work visa. I do know my friends who are approaching this age start to make very strategic decisions based on this issue.

I would guess the willingness of a school to hire a given teacher approaching a country's mandatory retirement age would depend on factors related to the country, school, and teacher.

Good luck.

You can also look based at membership in an organization like Council of International Schools in parts of Eastern Europe you are interested in. While membership in the organization is no guarantee of quality, it's not a bad place to start.

http://portal.cois.org/WCM/CIS/Director ... hools.aspx

I think this is a fairly good resource to look at international schools in a number of regions, though I see some schools I would avoid working at.

I had a friend from Harbin while I was in Shanghai. She hated winters in Shanghai, and I asked her if it wasn't a lot better down in Shanghai that Harbin given the temperature. Her response was the central heating found in Northern China made things pleasant, while the lack of heating at her university in Shanghai combined with the damp made things quite unpleasant. Remembering having to teach English in non-insulated, non-heated buildings in Shanghai with gloves that had the tips of the fingers cut off so I could hold chalk, I can see her point.

Granted, the farthest North I've been in China during the winter is Beijing.

Sounds like Shadowjack would be able to handle the cold just fine to me.

I don't have direct knowledge of the school, but here are my thoughts based on a pretty good understanding of China and reading their English and Chinese parts of their website. First, I wouldn't say that Shenyang is a city that is prone to get large numbers of ex-pats compared to some other Chinese cities (Beijing, Shanghai, Guangzhou but also even Suzhou, Hanghzhou, Nanjing, Chengdu, Tianjin). Looking at their website, this place screams 'private Chinese high school'. They may have a few ex-pat students, but I bet the majority are Chinese nationals. Look for it to be managed more like a Chinese school than an international school or a US school. Pay will be lower because of that, though Shenyang is likely to be far less expensive than some other major Chinese cities especially if you stick to Chinese food. I suspect Western food and brands will be harder to find.

On a side note, the Chinese dialect people would speak on a day-to-day basis would be very close to Mandarin. It would be a great place to learn to speak Mandarin if you have the motivation. It would be a great place to get a Chinese experience. My friends who taught English up there loved the people, though the cold got to them.

Probably a good place to get some experience, but if you are an experienced science teacher, there would be better schools and better paid positions available.

Good luck.

Newcounsel,

It's going to work out for you. School counselors are very much in demand.

I know of another single parent, who has been hired as a school counselor at 3 different international schools (these were tier 2 schools in two different regions). Also, once you fulfill a successful international contract as a school counselor, and you network with other international school counselors, then you may not even have to go through the job fair route next time.

Like other posters have mentioned, many early hires have a contact at the schools where they are being offered jobs. I'm new to working at international schools, but I had contacts with international schools through conferences and previous work as a college admission officer. This helped me get an early Skype interview and an offer. Two of my friends who have already been working as international school counselors were also offered and accepted jobs through Skype without attending job fairs. They were known by other counselors at those schools. In these two cases, they both moved from tier 2 schools up to tier 1 schools.

I would suggest that for a school counselor looking for a school which will send you to relevant international conferences (EARCOS, ECIS, AASSA, MAIS, AISA, IB, OACAC, NACAC) is quite important. The actual conference (or conferences) they send you to will depend on the region you're in and what level you are working at (elementary, middle, high school). Attending these allows you to continue PD, but also network for your next job. The bigger and wealthier schools tend to send school counselors to more of these conferences.

Good luck.

I reckon the biggest technological advance since my wife and I lived in China that will add to our quality of life this time around is the development of eReaders (Kindle, Nook, iPad). At the time it was relatively expensive to buy English language books and hard to find new English language books even in the major Chinese cities back when we lived there 10 years ago. Bringing English language books from home and trading/lending them to friends after reading them ourselves helped a bit. Maybe the difficulty of getting English language books in places like China has changed, but I doubt it.

My wife is getting a Kindle of her own for Christmas, and we've been starting to use our public library that lends out ebooks. We're hoping we can still do this when we go back to Asia next year. Even if we can't, the ability to buy ebooks on Amazon is wonderful.

OP, good luck in South Korea. (Hmm...bibimbop)

I agree completely with Sid. Good and bad advice together with terrible manners.

Vietnam and Thailand could work too, though there won't be as many schools as China. Quality of life in Thailand is better so the good jobs are really competitive, though there are jobs to be had both in private national schools with international curriculum and English teaching jobs for your boyfriend. Cost of living can be surprisingly high there especially in tourist areas from what I've heard people say.

From what I hear Vietnam has a lot of the same pros and cons as China, though it's smaller and not as wealthy a country. Some of the top schools seem to pay as well as the middle tier schools in China. I don't get the sense that people are clamoring to live there they way they are in Thailand.

Since you mentioned exploring cultures, I really recommend learning the local language beyond just survival/taxi level. Granted, reaching an elementary level of skill in Korean, Vietnamese, or Thai is a lot of work, but I had a much richer experience in China for being able to speak with average Chinese people. Granted, my first two years in China, I was teaching English and my contact hours were more modest than what one typically works at an IS.

Good luck with your plans.

From what you were saying about your boyfriend being an trained English teacher, I would suggest China or Korea as good places to focus.

1.) He could fairly easily get a teaching job in either country.

2.) In general people in those countries won't be concerned about your personal life (an international Christian or socially conservative school might - Yew Cheng, Shanghai Concordia, QSI etc.).

3.) Both pay fairly well for English teachers, so your boyfriend could make decent money, but you should make more than him unless you're at a terrible 3rd tier school (it can happen). I made more as a university lecturer with side tutoring/teaching jobs (these side jobs doubled my monthly salary) than as a science teacher at an IS in Shanghai. Mind you it was a low 3rd tier school in my opinion.

4.) Lots of schools schools with international curriculum (AP/IB/GCSE) popping up in China and decent growth in Korea as well, so a good number of options for you. Again, watch out for terrible schools in both places, but if you can hack two years then you have a lot more options moving forward.

5.) Depending on your boyfriend's schedule teaching English, he might be able to substitute teach at your school. This could be an in-road into working there if a spot opened up (depends on the school and your bf's qualifications) and getting into international teaching or adding some IT experience himself. Or being a substitute may pay pretty well, which could be good on its own.

I have some warnings. Just remember that there are some terrible schools out there, where two years can seem like a long time. If you're working at a school for Chinese nationals or Koreans nationals in China or Korea respectively, you'd essentially be working at a private high school with a foreign curriculum. Generally local (PRC; mainlander) Chinese cannot attend internationally-run schools in China. Neither can Koreans in Korea. Local Chinese teachers are treated pretty horribly by Chinese administrators; if you're a foreign teacher in one of these schools often you have them trying to treat you like a local. Realize that contracts are not always honored in either country, which can be very frustrating.

Being there with someone you care about can be helpful if you're both excited about living overseas. But I also saw what seemed like solid relationships end with the pressures of living overseas. Then again that happens everywhere.

Good luck.

I didn't find the questions to be all that different from the two. It seemed to be differentiated more based on their personal experiences than their position.

Good luck.

@SighGuy

Well, if you can't offer useful advice, or accurate advice, or well written advice, or even grammatically correct advice, then by all means try to respond after each of Sid's useful, thoughtful, and polite posts so people know you're still relevant. After a while they may even confuse your posts with what Sid wrote. And besides, I'm sure your quantity of posts will make up for their lack of quality. I'm also pretty sure you still win by having the most posts.