I was referring to a 100+K BAHT, not USD, I was pretty consistent in my posts. I refer to a Thai company to clarify.

Some new information I recovered actually supports a lot of the previous claims. The entery level starting salary ranges from $52,090 (133K Baht/month) to $70,750 (181K Baht/Month), converted and annualized over 12 months.

The top salary is $98,457, which after converting and annualizing comes out to 251K Baht/month, at step 20, and if your at half way on that salary scale thats hard to belive the difference between the middle and the top of the scale is only 11K Baht, (or $350 USD) which is a very small increase (about 1K Baht a month per year of service) considering the span at the entry level of 133K - 181K Baht thats what an average of .5% increase seems "paltry"

However, in light of that info, Id say apply to ISB, sounds like you will rake in the money. If anyone wants to look it up and settle the issue, you can find the info here:

http://www.isb.ac.th/ISB_Salary_and_Ben ... fault.aspx

I have a European pension that I keep moving around, but have a simple target date withdrawal retirement account in Hong Kong. Im heavily invested in the Vanguard index funds.I have enough business with them to avoid courtesy fees, and they are no load funds. Im not worried about what the US thinks, as i dont see my self going back. I'll probably retire in the Philippines/indonesia. If you want you can also pay self employment tax and earn social security credits, and once its "self taxed" you can invest in an IRA or 403b plan if you want. You can also apply for a foreign tax credit, and refund on any of the self employment tax you pay based on your tax return.

Not really unheard of, I had a similar opportunity when I was in Hong Kong. That being said its not usually part of the "standard" compensation package.

Yeah we seem to have reviewed different literature...

I agree with you completely, once a student is in university, the military, trade or vocational school your secondary transcript/diploma doesnt count (Some people do cease formal education at the end of secondary. Although when i was applying for my teacher certification program I had to submit my high school transcript to demonstrate "basic skills).

I really, really agree with you. Im not just giving lip service here, and I think you expressed it very well. As i wrote primary is important, by itself, but being the first and earliest entry into formal education, its also the first one forgotten, and quickly dismissed. Your also very right, that as a field we seem to collect a lot of those who didnt learn about sharing and playing well with others very well back in Kinder/Nursery. All that being said though, its not about how things "should" be but how things are, and nothing youve argued (and argued well) changes anything. I still spend 95% of my work load on secondary school action items, and schools still advertise their DIP's IB/A level scores, not their PYP advancement rate, and thats the measure of a schools worth and success. Its not fair but thats the way it is.

My BA is in Psychology, I have three masters, one in psychology, one in communications, an M.Ed (non terminal) in International education, and an Ed.D in Education. I dont call people idiots or resort to ad hominem attacks when I disagree with people.

Thats what all EC educators believe, and every educator thinks that their grade, age range, subject, etc is important and special. Each requires a special talent, an "eye" for development within that age group.

Look if I have chest pain and go to a cardiologist they say its your heart, go to an oncologist and its cancer, go to an endocrinologist and its a thyroid problem, psychiatrist, and its a chemical imbalance. Everyone thinks their specialty is well "special", and that theres is the most important, etc. When it comes down to it for every IBHL math teacher i know, i know 20+ primary teachers. Everyone either has a primary qualification, or has a spouse with a primary qualification. At the end of the day if i compare DIP2 to PYP1, DIP2 is more important.

This year I became an admin (academic/IB coordinator/VP). I just have more work on my end from secondary (upper secondary mainly) then primary. No one cares about primary grades or a primary transcript, after the student is out of primary (not even parents). That "Graduation Certificate" we give out at the end of PYP5 doesnt really mean anything (although the "tell MYP were on our way" song is kinda catchy), its not even graduation its advancing from one grade to another.

I'm sorry Im not trying to piss you off, or upset you, or diminish the work you do, or the skill required to do it. From my "landscape" (the forest, not the trees) perspective the only thing that really matters about primary is that the student is on or close to grade level when they get to MYP. Everything else is just sprinkles and frosting.

How did you get stuck with a local hire package? You've got to be in China, because youd starve on a local package in HK. I went from China (GZ) to HK (Kowloon), but was a foreign/international hire for both. I dont know how an individual school in HK would consider you. It would be on a case by case basis. Where are you from (meaning wheres your passport from)? Personally, I wouldnt tell them you were a local hire, at your current school, and if they ask, lie. Its really none of their businesses, and i doubt your current school would tell them. Just represent and act like your an international teacher (this assumes you come from a western country).

I dont know what school your at, but Im sure you know HK is a LOT more competitive then the mainland.

Yeah I took the same classes in child psych and development, and independently primary is important, and within primary even PYP1 is important, but as soon as I start comparing primary to secondary (especially when getting to upper secondary, like A levels, Gymnasium, and Diploma) they just dont compare to primary grades especially early childhood grades when it comes to the significance of student outcomes.
The same arguments can be applied to Special Ed, or any other special student population. Adolescent minds are just as difficult in the early teens when being saturated with hormones. Again, every teacher thinks their grade, and age group is special and difficult to teach. The only people that dont snicker at the "importance" of primary education, are primary teachers, and primary students parents.

@ Daisy

*Sigh*

Because the US, and the UK arent Thailand, and the cost of living ratios are just vastly different. Im tired of arguing "where i make this stuff up" with you because you've never demonstrated your right. I was watching Ratatouille this weekend, and you just remind me of the critic in the movie, and his speech he makes at the end.

"In many ways, the work of a critic is easy. We risk very little yet enjoy a position over those who offer up their work and their selves to our judgment. We thrive on negative criticism, which is fun to write and to read. But the bitter truth we critics must face, is that in the grand scheme of things, the average piece of junk is probably more meaningful than our criticism designating it so."

And thats all you offer and all you are is a critic, who researches nothing, advances nothing, says nothing, and succeeds only at dishing out personal attacks. Your modus operandi is simply to declare "your wrong", which is easy to do.

As always i didnt just make anything up. When I taught in Thailand (this was at the university level, and making 45K month) , some coworkers and I were at the Caribbean Club, and we met up with some ISB teachers, new first year teachers. Who after bragging about their 60K salaries, bought us a couple rounds. In addition, to that i reviewed all the schools on Search and ISS and no salary listed was as high as a 100K. The simple fact of cost of living economics is that $3,000 a month in Thailand with all expenses paid (Schools in the US dont pay all your bills) is a CEO's salary, and an insanely high amount of discretionary income.

@inman:

I can respect that, my apologies. I think I take my own experiences for granted sometime. Anyway thats not an excuse, and I'm sorry for characterizing you in such a light.

Thailand does "enjoy" an aura of mystery, though I dont think anymore so then China does (which has a pretty vast range of salaries as well). S.Korea, also has significant discrepancy in pay scales. If your really interested in nailing down more "on the scene" experience of Thailand, try the forums over at ajarn.com, its mostly ESL but their are a fair number of general education teachers as well. Outside that, if your a member of Search I wouldnt expect much more then the salaries posted on their school profiles.

Sorry, but Ichiro's claim of 180K Baht a month on the post (http://internationalschoolsreview.com/v ... php?t=1790) is VERY difficult to believe.

It has less to do with the various fairs (Search, ISS, COIS, etc) and more with the development of technology, mainly the internet and how it changed recruitment. Back in the Early 90's before every school had a web presence. It involved advertising in print magazines, newspapers, and journals, using a recruiter or, by word of mouth. Turnover and recruitment at schools was slow. Teachers got happy where they were because they really didnt have a means to compare and research schools globally. They would know the local schools and thats about it. You might be able to mail a resume to a school head at another school in your city (which were fewer in number as well), but how would you know if you were in Rome that there was an opening for a teacher in Japan? One of the goals of recent college graduates backpacking through europe was to keep an ear open for possible job opportunities.

As a result of the internet, teachers have more options and naturally became more mobile. It use to be 2 years was the "probationary" contract a teacher was offered, now its the standard initial contract and even at top schools teachers often leave for new regions and experiences even if the compensation package is good. Easier also means faster. Despite the large number of teacher influx from recession countries, the demand for "top" teachers is still very high, and they go fast. A good teacher at a fair may really only be available for a few hours. Even at the height of hiring season, a teacher one school wants is bound to have competing offers, and can be off the market in a day or two. There is a lot of pressure for hiring principals to "hire the best", this wouldnt be so bad if it werent for the explosion of IS's in the last decade. Basically, the demand for "top" teachers exceeds the supply, thats why when a school really wants you, things happen very fast. A school gets your resumer Monday, they want to interview you on Tuesday, the interview becomes a job negotiation. They email you a contract the same day. When that happens, thats the schools that want you. When you email them, and you get the form reply, then after a couple weeks you get an interview, etc, etc, thats when your not that schools preferred choice.

Anyway back to your question, its varied throughout my career. At the school im in which is a municipal school Our deadline is 21 before the last day of instruction which puts it around the middle of May. In Italy last year it was the first week of December. In China it was January 1, In Japan it was middle of November, and in Thailand it was the end of December.

I was hesitant to reply, but i've seen you post similar related posts on other topics. I dont see you getting 100+K Baht. There isnt a single school on search that even at MA+8 years pays 100K. I dont believe even ISB pays that much (despite Ichiro's comment to the contrary), oh there might be an admin there making that much, but not a teacher, at least not without a lot of years of experience. Even if it was ISB is "THE" elite school in Thailand, theyre number 1, everything else is underneath them. I'm sorry but a 100K+ salary would really be the rare exception and not what anyone would expect. You could ask about and apply to every IS in Thailand, and your not going to be offered a 100K+ salary.

Personally I think your letting a few replies on an anonymous board inflate the economics of working in Thailand. There are a number of those on this board who like to throw out their immense salaries, or how prestigous their school is, but even if true they dont represent the general population of international teachers.

If your strictly financially focused (and Im getting the sense you are) Thailand isnt the place for you. Its great if you want to live high on the expat life IN Thailand.

100K salary outside Thailand really isnt anything to brag about, its only 2000 £

Every teacher thinks that their subject and their grade level is important. It's either formative in primary or its summative in secondary. I've taught primary and secondary, and....

Sorry, I cant do it rocket science in Dip.2 physics actually involves 1) rockets, and 2) science. In PYP1 its "what color is the rocket"? I've seen the books in PYP1 they have a couple words per PAGE, and you do seem to spend a large ordinate amount of time coloring... On top of that you get graham crackers and juice boxes with a nap around noon. Grading involves looking at a worksheet with wiggly lines on it. Frankly the only people who care how well a PYP1 student is "doing" is mom, because their child is of course very special, talented, gifted, etc. They had them tested when they were 1 year old with the WPPSI, and they scored "very well". Never mind that the child cant decide between eating boggers or paste.

Yes you need to have energy to be a successful primary school teacher, but you need to have a lot of energy to be a successful salesperson as well. Energy doesnt equal expertise though.

News for you, EVERY teacher needs to be well versed and informed of educational methods and pedagogies. What do you think, we just recruit secondary teachers off the street, or order them online from Amazon? You think you have a monopoly on teacher education? Yeah, you might have a more functional knowledge of child psychology but secondary teachers have a deeper functional knowledge of adolescent psychology. Both fit under a broader term called "developmental psychology", and if you werent so ego centric youd recognize that primary teachers are no better trained and educated then secondary teachers, so go back to your nose wiping, until you grow up.


Postal script: I know the difference between there and the contraction they're (they are), i just dont believe in apostrophes. They're a waste of a key stroke and there is little efficiency gained, except by grammar gnomes who maintain dominion over their use as if they had owned them.

I'm surprised the middle east schools ahvent tried to sign you to a contract yet?

Europe has different regulations by country depending on if the school is a municipal school (public) or a private school. The reason has to do with labor regulations and unions. Seriously, its too early to get an offer from europe yet.

Id only endorse the American schools in Abu Dhabi and Dubai, and it would have to be the right position and a whole lot of other things to happen for me to take a position in the Middle east at all.

Your not a teaching couple, sorry. All though your situation is pretty common. Its not unusual for a trailing spouse once school starts or your into the year for them to be "found" a job or something. Usually substitute, teachers aid, receptionist, PTA organizer, etc..
Whatever you do DONT bring it up in the interview, or application process, because its a non issue, and cant help your candidacy at all. If anything its a possible mark against you. Here at my school (im a lower admin) our DP principal actually writes "Baggage" on their resumes for situations like that. To a school, attempting to leverage pressure in such away just implies a difficult employee or cost. If anything you could or say "Since my wife will be accompanying me, do you know if opportunities in the community are available for her to find employment?" I'd even avoid that though, since it might be interpreted, that you need them to find your wife a job. Incidentley, if your a member of Search Associates the schools profile has an item on their review that indicates if outside work for a spouse is available (in reality since school usually have no clue what the labor situation really is outside their school, its usually interpreted as meaning support positions for a spouse at the school may be/have been/will become available).