More on change in the recruiting, job hunting process from Jeff Utecht
http://is.gd/D98XYR

[b]Hello S.J.,

Thanks for the input and feedback -no offense taken or putdown received. :-)

Yes, it is a business I don't suffer from any illusions otherwise and I've made that point from the start in my first post up to the last when I wrote they (ISS) were shifting their business model to meet a changing market. Yes the SA element plays a a role --I'm signed-up with both agencies so I see this but I think it's also about a transforming dynamic in world affairs -not just commerce.

My angle on all this is that the landscape for the process of hiring internationally -and everywhere actually is changing and that as we educators constitute much of the "business" itself we have more self-determinism -or say- in the process due to new ways of doing things than we might realize. My argument with PsyGuy is really more about a clash of values, a distaste for the profiteering mentality and a personal belief that the job fair process is in many ways an outmoded way of facilitating hiring to build learning communities.

This is however, just my opinion based on my own and those close to me experiences. But that's what these forums are about -airing and sharing our experiences, thoughts, and as long as we're not too offensive -our feelings. So thanks for sharing yours!
[/b]

[quote="shadowjack"]What this tells me is that ISS is losing clients to SEARCH (honestly, most of my friends on the circuit use Search, not ISS - they tend to avoid it like the plague), so in order to attract quality candidates AND turn a profit on that section of their business, they are (a) removing recruiting fair costs, so they are free for all ISS clients; and (b) giving a deal on signup time for cost, so that they have a larger data base of teachers to present to schools.

This is business - it isn't being done because the old paradigm is no longer working - it is being done because they are losing business to a competitor.

If you honestly think that recruiters from schools are going to look through hundreds of electronic portfolios or that that nifty "learning package" you have "created" (did you really, or was it the person in the classroom next to you?), then I have some land in Florida to sell you.

Not trying to put you down, but ISS is a business. Their decision is based on what affects their bottom line. Also, I have known enough admin that they like to get out and glad hand and actually meet in person the teachers they are going to hire.

Just my thoughts on it.[/quote]

As mentioned in my response to PsiGuy Here's is a link to a leading article from the most recent International Schools Services publication NEWSLINKS

http://www.iss.edu/about-us/newslinks/a ... recruiting

--you'll need to paste this into your Browser URL area.

In several articles about use of technology and statistical studies on what factors influence teachers joining schools it shows not only a dramatic shift in the ISS business model -which has taken a huge hit the last few years -but support of trends which show that schools and teachers are operating in many new and different ways in their quests to come together in learning communities around the world.

Certainly worth reading and seeing as prepare to you venture out onto the job search frontier this year!

Dear PsyGuy et.al,

This will probably be my last response on this thread but as you've been the most active and faithful correspondent here -I'll say -thanks again.

However Mr PsyGuy, in the interest of holding you true to your assertions, I need to express that it is incongruous of you (and undermining to your credibility) to say that you don't generally share your views etc. on forums when you've made nearly 2000 posts in one year on this forum. By any measure that's quite a bit and it's not all "data".

Just to set the record straight I opened this thread not to merely vent but to share experiences and to investigate how others were thinking and feeling about the changing nature of int'l school hiring and the job fair process. As I actually obtained a job through the fairs (I was a "gold standard winner") my motivation was not wrathful but inquisitional. Because personal experiences almost always contain some subjective interpretation there is for sure a measure of opinion but no more than yours in your so called "factual" presentation of how all school leadership is thinking when they sign-on to meet with as many potential candidates as time permits in a two day job fair event in order to build their learning communities.

Actually, besides very vague references e.g, "about a quarter, a half, a third" you've presented zero factual information or data to support your understanding and presentation of the int'l school hiring process. Though laden with business and marketing metaphors your point of view is just that -a point of view. Thus you can not claim to speak with ultimate authority nor some overarching objective reality about the rapidly shifting nature of the international educational field, the socioeconomic factors driving it, the human element or reality itself. So you ought be more careful when you say you only care about "the data" when you've none to offer and when you condescendingly impose your opinions about the dangers of career (and world view) naivete on readers. Who are you anyway and who do you work for?

Your voluminous responses have revealed that as you're a businessman not an educator you've dived into waters beyond your ability to easily navigate because you do not share the same values as those who've committed their lives to the vocation of teaching. Apparently, to you teaching is just a profession, a job, a means to earn a living and so educators can be quantified, bought and sold like other commodities. To we educators it is a calling, a mission to which we're committed and while we want to make a decent living and live reasonably securely the majority of us in the field of education are not driven by a profit motive. Any values inventory taken among those in the business and education fields would reveal significant differences of kind I refer to here.

In parting I'd like to respond to you comment that you've not seen any riders indicative of change. Here's is a link to a leading article from the most recent International Schools Services publication

https://www.iss.edu/about-us/newslinks/ ... recruiting

In several articles about use of technology and statistical studies on what factors influence teachers joining schools it shows not only a dramatic shift in the ISS business model -which has taken a huge hit the last few years -but supportive of trends which show that schools and teachers are operating in many new and different ways in their quests to come together in learning communities around the world. I hope you will read it and -between the lines -the writing on the wall.

Wishing you a truly humane recruiting season this year -TS.

[i][quote="PsyGuy"]I dont share my particular feelings or opinions on forums in general. I care about the data, and as i presented here in this case is the admin leadership position. I realize that sometimes people come to this forum to "dump" to vent their frustrations, and thats okay. It is however naive and very dangerous to pretend that the way things "should be" is how they are. It reminds me of the cliché "The only problem with winning the rat race is your still a rat", well thats true, but losing the rat race means your a loser, and also a rat. You can choose not to participate of course, many teachers have done so in the pass, but your not going to change anything. A number of the top schools have been running their schools in this fashion for decades, some for over a century. The day of reckoning has been promised by many a wrathful teacher, I have not seen the riders yet, nor do I anticipate their arrival anytime soon.[/quote][/i]

Dear PsyGuy,

-Just want to thank you for all your input on this forum post. It seems likely that given the amount of time and need and authority you seem to present with here that you are not in or about the business of education -but rather the education business. Congrats. Not the nicest of jobs having to objectify and see people and learning communities as industrial models made up of pure commodities where teachers and others involved in the crafting of learning and nurture of our young are mere "meat" in an enterprise possess but apparently you believe that for the sake of ever efficiently staffing schools -someone has to do it.

While I think the whole job fair procedure is an outmoded, waste of resources that can largely be replaced by leveraging technology for other modes of encounter, I am truly relieved that people like yourself are not actually involved in working with directly with children or teachers where you'd be challenged daily to check your ego, vanity and "adjust your paradigm" to humanize or de-humanize them in order to manage the complexities of human relationships. If you were unable to do so you'd be overwhelmed by the messy and chaotic nature of personal variables that don't fit neatly into the commercial, enterprise model you've outlined for us here.

Please just know this -the game you and others are playing and profiting at in the "edu-business" has a shelf life and your days are numbered. With the advent of some many new telecommunications technologies and opportunities for personal entrepreneurship in managing ones career choices -recruiters, head hunting companies and similar handlers of talent will need to work extra hard to convince schools and clients that spending big money to fly around in hopes of maybe getting/granting an interview and/or job is a worthwhile expenditure. Especially when they can connect in a variety of other ways without getting on a plane, or checking into a five star hotel.

Once more thanks for all your input and presenting the business point of view.

Dear PsyGuy,

Thanks for weighing in. I'm not entirely sure about the motivation behind your counter points -maybe you've interpreted my posting as being one- sided or biased and as I've written from the position and experience of a candidate educator this may be so. However, I still must respectfully disagree with you that the agencies work for the schools. As you've acknowledged -they are in the end businesses, and thus I think it is more accurate to say that they work for themselves, not the schools or candidates.

Regarding fairness, my post was really not about the justness of the process. It was in part, about the experience many had recently and the challenges of understanding what the rules were as they apparently changed suddenly without many knowing. This left a number of schools and candidates dissatisfied with the process. Regarding costs; your order of magnitude and significance may apply on a larger scale when considering organizational needs first but try explaining this to an individual teacher who spends several thousands on airfare, hotel rooms, time off from work, the printing out resumes, portfolios etc. only to arrive and learn that the jobs advertised at the fair have all at the last minute evaporated and they are now leaving empty handed and unemployed. Participating in the job fair process costs a lot more than lot more than $200.00 and even so on an individual basis 200 beans is significant to an individual teacher.

As I've pointed out, this is not to say that no one has benefited from the job fair process, -many have -and I make that clear in paragraph five. However, I still strongly advocate educators angling more personalized encounters be they by telephone, skype or if the occasion allows face to face interviews because it seems a surer path to better understanding the process, maintaining equal control of it and certainly, if a deal is sealed without attending a fair -a more economical, time efficient one.

Finally, while it may be true that fairs are not designed to be a competition, anyone who has experienced the atmosphere will tell you it feels extremely competitive so much so that last year saw the advent of "screeners" school administrative staff standing at the end of long interview sign-up lines dissuading or encouraging potential candidates based on various criteria. In short, some made the cut, others did not. What's more, in the case of Search Associates fairs candidates must first apply and receive "invitations"to attend. It is a competitive process.

If you are involved in the job fair process in the future I hope you will consider the perspectives here as it may aid you in understanding what all the parties involved may be experiencing. This may help you "win" whatever goal it is that you have in mind for yourself, school or business clients.

As the season for job hunting is already here or approaching quickly, many are trying to determine whether or not they should either sign-up with recruiting agencies or register for job fairs. We who were whom were included in this last years wave of fair attendees, feel it is important that people should know that despite how they may currently promote their services, recruiting and staffing agencies such as Search Associates, and International Schools Services have not really changed; they are still expensive, time consuming, -no positive results guaranteed- operations and from an enterprise perspective -lucrative ones. Thus, there is also a now a proliferation of smaller outfits trying to cash in on the growing int'l school market but they're still mainly getting only the crumbs off the table.

Frankly speaking, these agencies big and small are businesses and few if any seem to actually, truly have the educator/admin candidate interest at heart beyond "placing" them which is really just the equivalent of making a sale. The truth is although you are assigned a "representative" they do minimal in advocating for you or placing you -they just sign you up and may (or may not) answer questions about the process if you have them -there is in reality seldom any work done on their part to actively match you to the market needs -that's your job. So this being the case, one way of looking at it is that when entering this relationship and/or process both the school and the candidate are working for these agencies -because whether or not a candidate is hired they and the school are paying so the agency involved profits.

The last SA event I attended in Bangkok (January 2012) was a frustrating experience for many educators and schools because this time around SA arranged the job fair schedule so the first day was set-up as being made available for "school info presentations". This was explained as being a way to allow schools to make their pitch in advance and better inform potential employees about their offerings. Sounds good and makes sense in theory, however, while these show and tell sessions were taking place many, schools were already meeting with candidates in the hotel rooms, the lounge, and even nearby bars for "informal" interviews which somehow resulted in a number of "formal" contracts being offered before the sign-up, interview and recruiting part of the fair actually began the next day. So quite a few jobs which had been posted for the fair were suddenly no longer available; they were filled via back room deals before people even had a chance to throw their hat into the ring and interview. Likewise, some candidates had already signed before schools were able to meet with them. Not good.

I'm not sure how much feedback SA received about this but I'm sure it was some. They were quick to proudly point to how many people were employed at the fair but the details of the how e.g., at what stage they were informed of positions being filled- were not discussed. Whatever the case, if I were going to sign-up for an SA or any agency fair I'd certainly raise the issue prior to registering, buying plane tickets, making hotel reservations for the whole event. Likewise if a prospective school replied to an employment inquiry or asked which fairs I was attending I'd want to ask them in return what their process or policy was about arranging meetings with contacts at these events and work to see if a phone, or skype interview with them could suffice.

It's only fair to mention that it is the case that are a number of successful school-candidate relationships that have been brokered through Search and other agencies, and they do have a vast number of schools in their database convinced that these recruiting fairs are still the best way to find talent and staff their schools.. However, despite these facts, the majority of people who've experienced job fairs will tell you that they are not the most ideal ways to connect with or interact with future employees. Beyond the big costs, the demands of what can be a time-crunched, stressful process has resulted in the fair experience being referred to as "a meat market, cattle call, and interview speed-dating sessions". These less than positive terms have arisen in the circuit for a reason.

In the final -, when considering fair attendance, it seems evident that using personal networking to get jobs with technology to augment leveraging word of mouth information or via directly contacting schools is absolutely the preferred way to go -even if you must sign-up with an agency just for access to their database.

This is unless for some strange reason that despite no guarantee of successfully landing a job one is of the mind that paying loads of cash to have some short face to face encounters with potential employers who are there to quickly sell their school and recruit talent has some added value beyond a little face to face networking with the int'l school good ole' boy network at their cocktail hour.

So with this caveat emptor about the fairs -best of luck to everyone who's job hunting this year!