@PsyGuy

If you must, the alleged ‘ miss pedo’ was discharged from extradition under article 8. Basically her mental ILLNESS and unique status of a foreign alleged child abuser would mean she is at risk of suicide whilst being detained. The length of the continuing trial was also in consideration in this ruling. Julia Kozma and Dr Richard Latham were the main experts in this decision.

She has been given non fugitive status in the UK. The judge believed she was reliable and consistent and the dropping of bail conditions and the absence of concrete evidence would allow her to think she may not need to return. He also studied evidence given from 2019 that led him to rule that she was too ill to travel and be uprooted from her support network. Being represented and the attempt to cooperate with law enforcement also aided this court decision. (Knowing an address of a defendant for 6 years? Does that require police knocking at your door or turning up at your employment, or would a date to surrender at Westminster be more appropriate? Opinion, but how ridiculous.)

She does not have fugitive status in Turkiye. The trial has not ended. Statute of limitations will be examined and appeals given. She will obviously appeal again to have her testimony given by video link or by writing. Only then will Turkiye rule that she is an ‘official’ fugitive.

You cannot continue your regressive argument that she needs to return. That door has closed and been bolted tight. You also cannot continue to compare prison standards or stages of illness. She HAS an illness. If it was cancer would she still be criticised for not returning? If it is a recognised illness that means she cannot return then as @IntlTeach says it truly is a kafkaesque system we live in. I believe in her testimony in court she said that she was not afraid of the court system, giving testimony or being tried. It was merely geography and health that had stopped her.

Let’s also go back to SUPPORT. It’s been mentioned before. Where is it from certain parties? You will no doubt say it is due to people thinking she is as a ‘pedo’. SUPPORT from this teacher was clearly from friends and family in her home country. No unions, opinions/ decisions of non teaching Boards of School, less than amazing SLT, transient staff and friends COULD have led her to her decisions. Conjecture, I already know, thanks but there are now some solid judgements available.

If you know her maybe reach out.

We know this is an extradition case but most people are relieved she does not have to languish in a Turkish prison for years until all methods of appeal have ended. An opinion from the UK legal system is a plus for putting pressure on Turkish authorities and also for her reputation.

Again, the findings in the extradition case will also be useful for the court in Strasbourg.

It is abundantly clear from Mcgarva’s findings that mental health was and is a huge issue so there is zero question now that she should have gone back to Türkiye.

@expatscot this particular case of extradition does not need prima facie evidence to extradite which is why the judges observations (not “opinions” as @PsyGuy writes) are so important in the case moving forward.

You are right the judgement is not “fluff”. PsyGuy needs to stick to his lane and troll about what he knows. He has been particularly hateful on this topic and clearly does not realise he is speaking about a real person, with widely reported mental health issues whose innocence is probably going to be proved in the future. I pity his colleagues and students for his lack of compassion.

The defence evidence IS important and until recently this had not made the media.

The ‘editorial fluff’ is taken from the judgement delivered by Judge Mcgava. ‘Inter alia’ suggests this point was one of many he made about the quality of evidence after reviewing ALL court documents.

The teacher was officially discharged from the extradition earlier in July.

https://www.doughtystreet.co.uk/news/gr ... -offending

“ The judge noted that while the merits of the underlying allegations were not a matter for the English courts, the Turkish prosecution’s case was “concerning” given that inter alia the complainant was interviewed in a manner which failed to accord with best practice, including the use of leading questions; allegations made by the complainant and her family that the requested person had abused an additional 15 pupils were not supported by any other pupil; and, the injuries relied on by the Turkish prosecution allegedly to demonstrate sexual abuse were, according to the defence expert evidence, readily explained by poor hygiene.”

Due process can now hopefully continue in Türkiye. Good luck to Rebecca.

An extradition case closed and no appeal and a criminal trial to proceed. Time will tell…

@PsyGuy

I find your answers and responses insufficient, naive and completely laughable.

@PsyGuy

No to absolutely all of your pathetic points. No date mix ups, unsatisfactory evidence all round. The police were even said to comment on the fact that there was no case.
The Turkish purge is conjecture. So so funny! All those journalists, lawyers and other professionals all locked away is just all made up.
Nope it would have been dropped or collapsed in all other countries with a strong rule of law and a strong child service procedure. Not nonsense, pure fact.
Please tell me where in Turkish law a case can be dropped sub juddice?
I agree, fleeing looks bad. But, being released from an investigation and returning home, does not. MLA exists. Severe mental health issues do. Also, I am not repeating myself again about the hundreds of issues facing the RP.

@PsyGuy

Nope, it was not a strong case to bring to trial. In fact I’ve heard many legal experts say how weak it is.

They ARE unfounded claims. They have not been examined over time, quite the opposite. They are still weak and insufficient.

The motivation behind CIMER set up by the AKP was perhaps set up to sack/witch hunt/purge Gulenists? It could be classed as very uneuropean?

The cctv entered to court was apparently extensive. The complaint made was on a specific day and logged. All children were playing in an area covered by cctv. It sounded like a child responding to a parents excessive questioning and made something up.

I’m for justice. Justice for all and nobody is getting it here. In my very humble opinion this case and trial in Türkiye is being influenced by the parents and scant regard is being paid to the actual child claimant and a defendant battling to save their reputation and liberty. It is a ridiculous charade.

Again, once a case has been pushed into a higher court in Türkiye it cannot be dismissed. I believe there was pressure to charge Richardson. This case should not have got this far. Extradition is the procedure necessary for it to come to a conclusion. I think if the teacher turned up they would quite literally be pooping themselves at court.

Places can have a rich culture at the beginning of a tenure with a continuing slide into autocracy and a diminishing rule of law by the end of it.

I don’t believe the UK or Türkiye have any interest in harbouring child abusers and they would have packed her off to the ‘Bul years ago if they thought she’d done it.

Fugitive or not. Fair trials have to exist.

And just as you have zero idea about whether the alleged (unfounded) events or true or not, I can make a stab that there could be some monetary motivation from the claimant parents or some sort of instability in their parenting.

Yawn

@PsyGuy

Reverse to February 2019. Richardson was released from all court restrictions due to there being no concrete evidence. Meaning the case was investigated thoroughly and at an end (and elsewhere that would be that).

However, after the attempted coup in 2016 the AKP set up a complaints process for citizens to complain about figures in public office. Its aim was less than transparent. After the claimant family started a formal procedure of complaint about the school and the prosecutor, Richardson was charged. I’d be scared at this point.

Move on to 2023. No new evidence has been submitted by the alleged claimants, yet in stark contrast to a few years ago, suspicion of a crime when charged has now moved to there being concrete evidence? I’d be petrified.

I am not confusing exoneration with extradition. I do however think if the UK were truly concerned Richardson had offended, a red notice would have been immediate and the UK would not have discharged her. Türkiye can also put pressure on the CPS to appeal a discharge. They did not. Odd?

The child’s medical reports show redness in the first report. The second report shows, fissures, scratches and bruises. The photograph timestamps back this timeline. The claimants also speak of an incident outdoors that cctv clearly shows was a fabrication.It maybe inconclusive, but it is also unfounded. Possibly a hysterical parent blaming everything upon a teacher rather than taking responsibility for it herself, methinks.

I was also referring to Richardson’s evidence, medical, Human rights and prison report which has not been touched upon in the press and is unknown in the mainstay. Also although an extradition judge cannot base his case on evidence he would be able to comment on issues he had observed. Without reading the judgement you cannot know his feelings around the quality of the evidence in the case.

Geographically, Türkiye is in Europe. It is a wonderful place to visit and for most ex pats, to live in. Check where it ranks in the World Justice project index (117). Take a look at some prison and torture reports... Find out about the Yalvac assurance… Look up what happened to BBCs Mark Lowen. See how much of their press is state owned? European, my backside.

Also as a side note. Take a scroll through some reviews from 2019 on this very site. The parents may have had a motivation behind THIS allegation. It’s only an opinion but it sets a scene.

Oh yes, we are all innocent until proven guilty. Let’s please start using ‘alleged’ whilst there is a trial ongoing. Ummm, it is child abuser. Survivors and rights groups look down on the use of ‘pedo’. You are supposed to be a teacher and all.

@PsyGuy

Oh give it up.

You know zero about Turkish law. The case cannot collapse or be dismissed once in court. There is just no mechanism for it to happen. If the parent claimants dropped the case and it went into settlement, maybe? The judiciary have to continue with due process.

You have not read the defence for the extradition case.

You do not know the judgement from the extradition case you are just guessing. There was no appeal from the CPS?

You do not know the contents of the medical report.

Comparing this poor woman to Epstein? Time to retire from teaching and this forum. What a vile troll you’ve become. Go work on some sleazy media outlet where you can band around the hideous ‘miss pedo’ tag like The Sun newspaper in the UK.

It would have been over in weeks or days in most other jurisdictions that are independent and not so politically motivated.

I wouldn’t wish false allegations on any teacher, but I could be changing my mind?

Thank Christ for ECHR.

@PsyGuy
1) it was carried out by a trained psychologist for law enforcement. It is being treated as concrete evidence although her questioning was led and tagged.

2) of course they know about the report! Why do you think the parents sued the lawyer and experts! Maybe the judge just doesn’t want open the can of worms it contains?

3) Yeap. But it is YEARS later and she is middle aged and been in the media?

4) The question you need to ask is why wouldn’t she return? It is part of the ECHR so she can take it to Strasbourg. Read the original article again. You do know something of Türkiye, surely? Do you know about the complaint procedure that was set up by AKP and what the motivation might be? Do you think she felt supported? Do you think she was actually well enough to face a lengthy trial procedure? Or are you one of the anti woke brigade that thinks moderate to severe depression is just being a bit sad. Take a look at the implications of false allegations on your profession, PsyGuy? If we don’t want to pathologise the teacher, 6 years is a long time to be called ‘Miss Pedo’…


5) UK and Türkiye can obtain evidence through Mutual Legal Assistance. This can be DNA and interviews etc. Look it up.

6) AGAIN, why didn’t she want to return? Did she feel unsafe? Was she too ill? Did she know the trial would last a few years (things take a long time over there, there was zero chance of teaching again) and she would not have medical care, a job or be around her elderly parents? Would the school still give her support? No union and no pay and no free legal representation. AGAIN, Turkey is In Europe and ECHR, but should it be? For some (probably not) inexplicable reason she felt she couldn’t return.

OR stay put in your ‘relatively’ safe European home and take the case to Strasbourg where being an independent foreign white single woman won’t be held against you.

And do you really stupidly think if she had stayed it all would have disappeared in five minutes??? The whole ordeal is ridiculous and unfounded.
The end!

Just to correct you on a couple of points @PsyGuy

The child was not interviewed by the defence, but by law enforcement. It was recorded.

The defence forensic expert report has never been heard in the Turkish court. The claimant parents made a criminal complaint against the defence lawyers and the three forensic experts who had written the report. No action was taken after an investigation so they again complained about the lack of inaction. Again it was found that the experts acted within the agreements of the court.

I think 6 and a half years later or 20 plus years more of teaching, other victims would have come forward. For now, this is NO serial abuser.

Richardson left legally due to lack of concrete evidence. She had not been asked for DNA samples due to the child’s interview and the type of assault she alleged she experienced.

Richardson, like many of us in IT was an early years teacher. Normal, respectful, high quality care in EY would mean teachers support children and would handle clothing, hold hands, occasionally need to support children by picking them up etc. children would be toilet trained but accidents happen. Touch DNA would almost be a certainty from the alleged crime scene. From an incident at home 3 days later? Not so sure. It is ‘fuzzy’ because it is not clear who has been eliminated by testing. In the latest court records it appears it is the claimant child and a profile that is similar? This has not always been clear.

The news says Richardson will not be extradited. There is no info about the actual judgement. Despite this, her team have attempted many times for her to be heard and she still has a right to a fair trial.

The UK currently has an agreement with Türkiye that all RPs must serve their sentence Yalvac prison.

I admire your dedication and support to survivors, but this is a forum for ITs and you yourself know that accusations happen to us all. People are innocent until proven guilty. I don’t believe for one second that Richardson is engaging in DARVO principles.

However, the DEFENCE and the CLAIMANT should both be heard by the court (and the media) until a judgement has been given.

@PsyGuy

“Again the DEFENSE expert says the child was uncooperative. Could be because
> the DEFENSE expert isnt an advocate for the victim.”

There are two acceptable ways of spelling defence/defense depending which English speaking country you are from. Are you even an international teacher. Broaden that mind and outlook.

I also meant to point out that you clearly struggled with the meaning of prima facie, too, but thought it a bit rude.